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Old January 11th, 2012, 04:36 PM   #1
myp
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Who is killing Iran's nuclear scientists?

David Frum brings up the question on his new blog after 3 scientists have died and raised questions as to whether the US or Israel might be behind the deaths:

http://www.thedailybeast.com/article...mb-makers.html
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Old January 11th, 2012, 06:09 PM   #2
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Likely Mossad. Don't blame them - Israel's national existence is at stake.
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Old January 11th, 2012, 06:26 PM   #3
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myp, et al,

It is a good question. But I think the obvious answers are not necessarily the correct answers.
Quote:
Originally Posted by myp View Post
David Frum brings up the question on his new blog after 3 scientists have died and raised questions as to whether the US or Israel might be behind the deaths:

http://www.thedailybeast.com/article...mb-makers.html
(COMMENT)

Of course it would appear that most people will assume that it is either the US or Israel that is behind these activities.
  • Assassination of five Iranian Scientists.
  • The sabotage of construction sites at nuclear facilities.
  • The cyber attacks against computer systems and networks at Iranian nuclear facilities and research centers.

But, in addition to localized internal factions (government resistance) within Iran, that wish to avoid a confrontation over nuclear proliferation, there are a number of Middle East/Persian Gulf states that also have objections to Iran developing a nuclear program.

Then, of course, there is the internal workings of governing bodies that have a vested interest in "preserving the Islamic Revolution, territorial integrity, and national sovereignty." And surprisingly, these adjunct bodies might be conducting an operation that intentionally sets-back the critical nuclear weapons design program and the associated development in a strategic delivery system.

The Iranians are not as stupid as we often portray them to be. They understand that having a nuclear launch capacity is a political, military and economic liability. And they are looking for a way to save face, but at the same time, disrupt the advancement of these two programs. They know that if a confrontation were to erupt, no matter the ultimate outcome, Iran will be severely damaged politically, militarily, and socio-economically. The Supreme National Security Council wants to preserve the Islamic Revolution from decay and the integrity of the Supreme Leadership. The Military Commanders do not want to see the bulk of their forces destroyed in a meaningless confrontation and wish to guard the independence and territorial integrity of the nation.

(EXTERNAL CLANDESTINE ACTIVITY)

The Iranian Ministry of Intelligence and Security (MOIS) is nearly a direct action arm of the Supreme Leader (not the Presidency). It is bound by the need to protect the Supreme Leaders control (like most Secret Police Organizations); and the Islamic Revolution. MOIS's head is a senior cleric (not a professional intelligence and security officer). It functions under the interpretative limitations of the religious leader.

While the MOIS has a general mission statement to gather, procure, analysis, and classification of necessary information inside and outside the country (like most intelligence agencies world-wide), the security side is responsible for disclosing conspiracies that sabotage the integrity of the Islamic Republic. And that is a key element: the integrity of the Islamic Republic.

Regionally, there are a number of nearby neighbors that have very free and numerous legal travelers in the Iran. The include, but are not limited to:
  • Russia
  • China
  • Kuwait
  • Saudi Arabia

Each of these nations have a reason to limit the R&D advancement of Iran in the proliferation of CNWDI; and the adjunct supporting programs. Their individual reasons may, in some cases, overlap, while other are purely utilitarian. But at the end of the day, all of these nations have no real interest in seeing Iran becoming the dominant regional power supported by a nuclear capacity. One, or more of these nations may, in fact, be running operations against the programs.

It is relatively easy to place the blame on the US or Israel; in fact, a Presidential Candidate has openly stated that he hope the US is involved in these sabotage efforts. This lends good cover to externals that might be less suspect.

Most Respectfully,
R

Last edited by RoccoR; January 11th, 2012 at 06:30 PM.
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Old January 12th, 2012, 05:53 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by myp View Post
David Frum brings up the question on his new blog after 3 scientists have died and raised questions as to whether the US or Israel might be behind the deaths:

http://www.thedailybeast.com/article...mb-makers.html
Let me go out on a short limb. They could be killing their own.

1.It is a good way to keep them from telling "secrets" in the future.

2.They can always blame it on the US and Israel. That would keep their own people occupied and off their neck.
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Old January 12th, 2012, 07:15 AM   #5
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US and its mistress are usual suspects ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by myp View Post
David Frum brings up the question on his new blog after 3 scientists have died and raised questions as to whether the US or Israel might be behind the deaths:

http://www.thedailybeast.com/article...mb-makers.html
US and its mistress are usual suspects. Probably, it is true too.
White man wants to have nuclear power only in the hands of White man i.e. US, France, Russia, Mistress Israel. White man knows its consequences as it has dropped two on Japan annihilating over 200K Japanese civilians and justifies its ghastly act as revenge for Pearl harbor attack which claimed ~3K lives.
It could not control China, India, Pakistan, North Korea.
Libya agreed with US not to nuclear and Gadafi was killed.
If Iraq was nuclear, White man would not have dared to attack.
Iran does not want to make that mistake.
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Old January 12th, 2012, 09:28 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by netanyahoo View Post
US and its mistress are usual suspects. Probably, it is true too.
White man wants to have nuclear power only in the hands of White man i.e. US, France, Russia, Mistress Israel.
Dangerous devices have to be kept out of the hands of hysterical ragheads.


Quote:
White man knows its consequences as it has dropped two on Japan annihilating over 200K Japanese civilians and justifies its ghastly act as revenge for Pearl harbor attack which claimed ~3K lives.
Don't want to be jacked up by the white man? Don't mess with us.

Quote:
It could not control China, India, Pakistan, North Korea.
Libya agreed with US not to nuclear and Gadafi was killed.
He was killed for completely unrelated reasons.

Quote:
If Iraq was nuclear, White man would not have dared to attack.
Iran does not want to make that mistake.
Iran won't be allowed to have nukes, any more than one would allow a baby to play with a gun.
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Old January 12th, 2012, 09:58 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DodgeFB View Post
Let me go out on a short limb. They could be killing their own.

1.It is a good way to keep them from telling "secrets" in the future.

2.They can always blame it on the US and Israel. That would keep their own people occupied and off their neck.
Possibly, but why would they do it before they created what they want? More likely than that is opposing groups within Iran.
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Old January 12th, 2012, 10:25 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by myp View Post
Possibly, but why would they do it before they created what they want? More likely than that is opposing groups within Iran.
They could do things in steps. With few knowing what is going on down the the hall. But I do agree it could be opposing groups in Iran. Either way we get the blame.
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Old January 12th, 2012, 12:32 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by netanyahoo View Post
White man wants to have nuclear power only in the hands of White man i.e. US, France, Russia, Mistress Israel. White man knows its consequences as it has dropped two on Japan annihilating over 200K Japanese civilians and justifies its ghastly act as revenge for Pearl harbor attack which claimed ~3K lives.
The bombs were not dropped for "revenge." They were dropped to prevent a long and drawn out ground invasion of Japan, where it is more than likely that just as many people would have died.
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Old January 13th, 2012, 07:42 AM   #10
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Israel has nukes and its lover US behind

Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick View Post
Likely Mossad. Don't blame them - Israel's national existence is at stake.
Israel has nukes and its lover US behind. So, they have nothing to worry.
That is just an excuse to destroy all Middle East countries around it.
Mistress knows in their hearts that they have forcefully carved that country in Palestine. This makes them fearful and schizophrenic for life.
There is no remedy for that. They need to take Prozac.
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Old January 13th, 2012, 09:38 AM   #11
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The answer is obvious

Quote:
Originally Posted by netanyahoo View Post
Israel has nukes and its lover US behind. So, they have nothing to worry.
That is just an excuse to destroy all Middle East countries around it.
Mistress knows in their hearts that they have forcefully carved that country in Palestine. This makes them fearful and schizophrenic for life.
There is no remedy for that. They need to take Prozac.
Who has a history of assassinating troublesome Muslim opponents who threaten the security of their nation in one way or another? The Israelis. The fact that they denied having done so just about confirms that they did it, as they also have a fairly formulaic denial which has been used for past killings (usually Palestinian terrorists) which in many cases was later proven to have been carried out by Mossad.
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Old January 13th, 2012, 09:46 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skeptic-f View Post
The fact that they denied having done so just about confirms that they did it, as they also have a fairly formulaic denial which has been used for past killings (usually Palestinian terrorists) which in many cases was later proven to have been carried out by Mossad.
How does that logic make sense? I can pretty much guarantee you that if you asked any government in the world right now if they did it they would deny it as well.
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Old January 13th, 2012, 10:22 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by netanyahoo View Post
Israel has nukes and its lover US behind. So, they have nothing to worry.
That is just an excuse to destroy all Middle East countries around it.
Mistress knows in their hearts that they have forcefully carved that country in Palestine. This makes them fearful and schizophrenic for life.
There is no remedy for that. They need to take Prozac.
Save the prozac for the rags who blow themselves up.
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Old January 13th, 2012, 10:23 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skeptic-f View Post
Who has a history of assassinating troublesome Muslim opponents who threaten the security of their nation in one way or another? The Israelis. The fact that they denied having done so just about confirms that they did it, as they also have a fairly formulaic denial which has been used for past killings (usually Palestinian terrorists) which in many cases was later proven to have been carried out by Mossad.
Mess with the israelis, and they mess back. What part doesn't anyone get?
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Old January 13th, 2012, 02:16 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick View Post
Likely Mossad. Don't blame them - Israel's national existence is at stake.
Israel's existence is at stake? I surely hope so. They shouldn't exist in the first place.
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Old January 13th, 2012, 02:18 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RoccoR View Post
myp, et al,

It is a good question. But I think the obvious answers are not necessarily the correct answers.
(COMMENT)

Of course it would appear that most people will assume that it is either the US or Israel that is behind these activities.
  • Assassination of five Iranian Scientists.
  • The sabotage of construction sites at nuclear facilities.
  • The cyber attacks against computer systems and networks at Iranian nuclear facilities and research centers.

But, in addition to localized internal factions (government resistance) within Iran, that wish to avoid a confrontation over nuclear proliferation, there are a number of Middle East/Persian Gulf states that also have objections to Iran developing a nuclear program.

Then, of course, there is the internal workings of governing bodies that have a vested interest in "preserving the Islamic Revolution, territorial integrity, and national sovereignty." And surprisingly, these adjunct bodies might be conducting an operation that intentionally sets-back the critical nuclear weapons design program and the associated development in a strategic delivery system.

The Iranians are not as stupid as we often portray them to be. They understand that having a nuclear launch capacity is a political, military and economic liability. And they are looking for a way to save face, but at the same time, disrupt the advancement of these two programs. They know that if a confrontation were to erupt, no matter the ultimate outcome, Iran will be severely damaged politically, militarily, and socio-economically. The Supreme National Security Council wants to preserve the Islamic Revolution from decay and the integrity of the Supreme Leadership. The Military Commanders do not want to see the bulk of their forces destroyed in a meaningless confrontation and wish to guard the independence and territorial integrity of the nation.

(EXTERNAL CLANDESTINE ACTIVITY)

The Iranian Ministry of Intelligence and Security (MOIS) is nearly a direct action arm of the Supreme Leader (not the Presidency). It is bound by the need to protect the Supreme Leaders control (like most Secret Police Organizations); and the Islamic Revolution. MOIS's head is a senior cleric (not a professional intelligence and security officer). It functions under the interpretative limitations of the religious leader.

While the MOIS has a general mission statement to gather, procure, analysis, and classification of necessary information inside and outside the country (like most intelligence agencies world-wide), the security side is responsible for disclosing conspiracies that sabotage the integrity of the Islamic Republic. And that is a key element: the integrity of the Islamic Republic.

Regionally, there are a number of nearby neighbors that have very free and numerous legal travelers in the Iran. The include, but are not limited to:
  • Russia
  • China
  • Kuwait
  • Saudi Arabia

Each of these nations have a reason to limit the R&D advancement of Iran in the proliferation of CNWDI; and the adjunct supporting programs. Their individual reasons may, in some cases, overlap, while other are purely utilitarian. But at the end of the day, all of these nations have no real interest in seeing Iran becoming the dominant regional power supported by a nuclear capacity. One, or more of these nations may, in fact, be running operations against the programs.

It is relatively easy to place the blame on the US or Israel; in fact, a Presidential Candidate has openly stated that he hope the US is involved in these sabotage efforts. This lends good cover to externals that might be less suspect.

Most Respectfully,
R
Guy, what are you smoking? It could ONLY be the USA, urged on by its master, Israel. There is ZERO chance it is anyone else. Put the weed away.
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Old January 13th, 2012, 02:20 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DodgeFB View Post
Let me go out on a short limb. They could be killing their own.

1.It is a good way to keep them from telling "secrets" in the future.

2.They can always blame it on the US and Israel. That would keep their own people occupied and off their neck.
Oh yes, nuclear scientists are a dime-a-dozen in Iran.

Where the **** do you dig up these people, MVP?
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Old January 13th, 2012, 02:21 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick View Post
Dangerous devices have to be kept out of the hands of hysterical ragheads.




Don't want to be jacked up by the white man? Don't mess with us.



He was killed for completely unrelated reasons.



Iran won't be allowed to have nukes, any more than one would allow a baby to play with a gun.
I love it. Only the USA may have nukes. What ****ing arrogance. The USA has absolutely NO RIGHT to prevent Iran from manufacturing nukes. ZERO. NADA. KAPUTSKY.
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Old January 13th, 2012, 03:04 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fascist Canuck View Post
Oh yes, nuclear scientists are a dime-a-dozen in Iran.

Where the **** do you dig up these people, MVP?
Well my username is myp not mvp, but Dodge is plenty of times smarter, kinder, and more respectable than you are. I am fairly confident that the vast majority of the world would agree with me on that too.
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Old January 13th, 2012, 04:04 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fascist Canuck View Post
I love it. Only the USA may have nukes. What ****ing arrogance. The USA has absolutely NO RIGHT to prevent Iran from manufacturing nukes. ZERO. NADA. KAPUTSKY.
If we say no, it's a no go.
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