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Old August 14th, 2012, 05:33 PM   #1
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Israel the victim?? Really?!?

http://www.opednews.com/articles/Isr...20813-508.html
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Old August 14th, 2012, 08:41 PM   #2
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The Iranians want nukes for the same reason Israel does, the Arabs keep trying to kill them. The only reason Israel and Iran play this game with each other is to keep the religious fundamentalists happy, extremists Jews hate Muslims, extremist Muslims hate Jews. By having this little cold war and ignoring the Arabs that pose the real threat, the politicians keep getting reelected and a real shooting war never actually happens. It'd be genius if not for the fact that it's purely coincidental.
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Old August 15th, 2012, 07:53 AM   #3
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To some degree i agree with you, it just amazes me how the Israeli line of being this helpless victim is so widely accepted.
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Old August 15th, 2012, 03:19 PM   #4
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Who is funding Hezbollah? Not the Israelis.
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Old August 15th, 2012, 08:05 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Road Warrior View Post
Who is funding Hezbollah? Not the Israelis.
The only reason Israel doesn't have an equivalent in Iran is because they have the resources to screw with Iran themselves, Iran doesn't and so they use a local proxy. Don't confuse superior capabilities with a moral high road.
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Old August 16th, 2012, 05:18 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by Road Warrior View Post
Who is funding Hezbollah? Not the Israelis.
If you look up how hezbollah came to exist you'll see it was during Israel's invasion of Lebenon. They were the militia that was formed to push back the invasion. Besides hezbollah is not bombing religious places in Israel.
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Old August 16th, 2012, 05:42 AM   #7
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The Iranian regime threatens the region and İsrail. Also They express it clearly. İn this case, of course İran's nuclear activity poses a threat to security and stability of ME.

For this article, I want to remind you that as far as I know, İsrael isn't a part of any nuclear disarmament agreement or a kind of nuclear agency, unlike İran.
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Old August 16th, 2012, 06:24 AM   #8
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The Iranian regime threatens the region and İsrail. Also They express it clearly. İn this case, of course İran's nuclear activity poses a threat to security and stability of ME.

For this article, I want to remind you that as far as I know, İsrael isn't a part of any nuclear disarmament agreement or a kind of nuclear agency, unlike İran.
Firsly Iran threatens the region? How many wars has Israel started just in the last 20 years??? A few times Lebenon (where they occupied for 20 years) and the Palestenians... Not to mention attacks on Syria and Iraq. Iran on the other hand has not started a war in the last 200 years. I love this argruement that a country that has no nuclear weapons poses more of a threat than a country that has 200 nuclear weapons! Do you hear yourself?
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Old August 16th, 2012, 09:33 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by amirex111 View Post
Firsly Iran threatens the region? How many wars has Israel started just in the last 20 years??? A few times Lebenon (where they occupied for 20 years) and the Palestenians... Not to mention attacks on Syria and Iraq. Iran on the other hand has not started a war in the last 200 years. I love this argruement that a country that has no nuclear weapons poses more of a threat than a country that has 200 nuclear weapons! Do you hear yourself?
Do you know that a bus, full of İranian generals caught in Syria just a few days ago or have you ever heard anything about the terrorist organization PKK camps on the İranian border.


They have been in wars already, just indirectly in it's region.


For the nuclear weapons, as I said before, there is no legal responsibility for İsrael in today's situation, but İran is part of some agreements and they had started the programe with the support of west and us at first, there are things that bring responsibility for İran. İf a country has nuclear weapons in it's inventory, it doesn't create the same legal status for another one. İran is a side of different deals.


On the other hand they often state threatening things like destroying Israel, removing from map etc.

Note that we talk about a theocratic government
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Old August 16th, 2012, 09:49 AM   #10
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Quote:
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On the other hand they often state threatening things like destroying Israel, removing from map etc.

Note that we talk about a theocratic government
1. It was a quote, claiming whatever his name is said that is no different then when everyone claimed the Pope hated Muslims because he quoted a Roman emperor.

2. It only referred to the gov't. Even if Iran did have it out for Israel (it doesn't, as I've explained) Iran isn't going to actually say anything to that effect least it piss off it's largest minority group by being anti-semitic.
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Old August 16th, 2012, 01:17 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reader View Post
Do you know that a bus, full of İranian generals caught in Syria just a few days ago or have you ever heard anything about the terrorist organization PKK camps on the İranian border.


They have been in wars already, just indirectly in it's region.


For the nuclear weapons, as I said before, there is no legal responsibility for İsrael in today's situation, but İran is part of some agreements and they had started the programe with the support of west and us at first, there are things that bring responsibility for İran. İf a country has nuclear weapons in it's inventory, it doesn't create the same legal status for another one. İran is a side of different deals.


On the other hand they often state threatening things like destroying Israel, removing from map etc.

Note that we talk about a theocratic government
If you are concerned about legality of things, Iran has always said it doesn't want nukes. Also continuing with your legal world view Iran has not done anything illegal and is within its rights to have a civilian enrichment program. To top the cherry legalness of it all, Iran can legally leave the NPT and than make nukes. I wonder if you would than be ok with Iran having nukes like Isreal legally has them.
I never debated legality with you I pointed out that a nuclear state threatening a non-nuclear state with attack for its civilian program is a crazy world we are living in.
But with people like you brainwashed by the media, things are as they are.

P.s. David is right iran never said it wanted to wipe anyone off anything... It quotoed khomaini who has long died that the gov. of Israel will pass like the soviets did.
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Old August 17th, 2012, 06:22 AM   #12
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Road Warrior, et al,

The idea here is not correct. Iran may be a contributor, but clearly not the sole source of funding by a long shot.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Road Warrior View Post
Who is funding Hezbollah? Not the Israelis.
(COMMENT)

The funding of Hezbollah is very diverse. In addition to Irans contribution, Hezbollah acquires funding through:
An array of criminal enterprises to include:
  • Drug Smuggling (Especially the South American cocaine trade.)
  • Extortion
  • Money Laundering
  • Counterfeiting
Direct and Indirect donations:
  • Rich Lebanese Shias
  • Maques Zakat Contributions
  • Open Political Contributions
  • Humanitarian Aid and Charitable Contributions
AND, it is important to remember that Hezbollah has a number of incomes derived through legitimate investment portfolio's; some saying this is the real bulk of the income.
Now, I'm not saying that Iran (or any number of other dark Arab Sources) don't contribute to the aid of Hezbollah; it is just that Iran is not the major source of funding. There are even well connected and wealthy Saudi's that contribute to the various terrorist organizations, including Hezbollah.

Most Respectfully,
R

Last edited by RoccoR; August 17th, 2012 at 06:23 AM. Reason: Spelling, Grammar, Syntax
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Old August 17th, 2012, 11:38 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amirex111 View Post
If you are concerned about legality of things, Iran has always said it doesn't want nukes. Also continuing with your legal world view Iran has not done anything illegal and is within its rights to have a civilian enrichment program. To top the cherry legalness of it all, Iran can legally leave the NPT and than make nukes. I wonder if you would than be ok with Iran having nukes like Isreal legally has them.
I never debated legality with you I pointed out that a nuclear state threatening a non-nuclear state with attack for its civilian program is a crazy world we are living in.
But with people like you brainwashed by the media, things are as they are.

P.s. David is right iran never said it wanted to wipe anyone off anything... It quotoed khomaini who has long died that the gov. of Israel will pass like the soviets did.
Don't think it's legally way that leaving anything easly after receiving help with various commitments. İf they do not want it, they could prove it to the world by allowing research etc.


Are you seriously expecting me believe whatever the İranian goverment says ? Just a week ago they said that a gruop of their generals has gone to the Syria to visit religious buildings out there, a place that in intense conflicts, so you believe that because you are not 'brainwashed' by media but İran's media.

I'm not backing anyone, İran is a threat not just for İsrael, also for it's region (Iraqi Kurdistan, Turkey and the developments in Syria.) İf it become a nuclear assets that will lead more tension in the region.Statements(by you or the goverment) that questioning the rights to have nuclear weapons, why they or why not İran, also tells the truth, between the lines.

Last edited by reader; August 17th, 2012 at 11:42 AM.
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Old August 17th, 2012, 02:35 PM   #14
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Quote:
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Don't think it's legally way that leaving anything easly after receiving help with various commitments. İf they do not want it, they could prove it to the world by allowing research etc.


Are you seriously expecting me believe whatever the İranian goverment says ? Just a week ago they said that a gruop of their generals has gone to the Syria to visit religious buildings out there, a place that in intense conflicts, so you believe that because you are not 'brainwashed' by media but İran's media.

I'm not backing anyone, İran is a threat not just for İsrael, also for it's region (Iraqi Kurdistan, Turkey and the developments in Syria.) İf it become a nuclear assets that will lead more tension in the region.Statements(by you or the goverment) that questioning the rights to have nuclear weapons, why they or why not İran, also tells the truth, between the lines.
Debating with you is like debating a child. You just don't have enough info to be taken seriously. You for example know nothing about the shiite religion. Shiites make pilgrimages in the worst of situations including iraq, saudi arabia, and yes syria. For example, even though they are treated like animals in saudi arabia they still go because they have a religeous duty.

The question about letting inspectors in. Firstly, they are in with cameras. But the problem is, google answering a negative. Once you have done this you might be wiser. Iran had extra allowance for 3 years but the "inspectors" as they did in iraq only use them for a never ending game of spying on military secrets. What would you do when you tell inspectors look all over and they never end their search?
Also it has never been a question of if iran has nukes, all spy agencies including the US say iran hasnt even decided if they want them. Its more of a question of if they have the right as every other npt nation to have a civilian program.
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Old August 17th, 2012, 09:24 PM   #15
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I do find it funny that people get all worried by Iran having nukes but are cool with the RF and US (the 1st having a 1st strike policy, the 2nd having actually used them on civilian populations) having the ability to wipe out all land based life on the planet.
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Old August 18th, 2012, 04:20 AM   #16
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The real reason the US has a problem with Iran is explained here:

http://therealamirtaheri.blogspot.co...y-outlier.html
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Old August 18th, 2012, 11:09 AM   #17
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Quote:
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Is Israel a victim
No Israel is not a victim but it keeps using that line and has done for the last 60 years. Israel is an oppressor of people,those people being the Arabs in the west bank and Gaza. Israel had a very nice run spreading its version of events until the introduction of the Internet but now that run has come to an end and people around the world can see Israel for what it really is and it does not look good.
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Old August 18th, 2012, 11:11 AM   #18
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The real reason the US has a problem with Iran is explained here
The reason the US has a problem with Iran is that Iran has all that lovely oil and does not bow down to US wishes and that is it. The Americans have been annoyed since their man the Shah got booted out over 30 years ago.
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Old August 18th, 2012, 11:51 AM   #19
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The reason the US has a problem with Iran is that Iran has all that lovely oil and does not bow down to US wishes and that is it. The Americans have been annoyed since their man the Shah got booted out over 30 years ago.
Agree completly!
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Old August 18th, 2012, 12:17 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by RoccoR View Post
Drug Smuggling(Especially the South American cocaine trade.)wealthy Saudi's that contribute to the various terrorist organizations, including Hezbollah. Most Respectfully R
Have you actually got any evidence that Hizbollah get funding from South American cocaine? I have heard the stories but never seen the evidence,sounds like a story made up by the CIA or Mossad. I would not class Hizbollah as a terrorist organisation either and most of the entire world do not class them as that.
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