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Old August 9th, 2017, 05:19 AM   #1
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your take on the leakers

So if you watch the news you are aware of the many leaks occurring at or relating to the White House and President Trump.

So what do you think?
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Old August 9th, 2017, 05:25 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arcturus88 View Post
So if you watch the news you are aware of the many leaks occurring at or relating to the White House and President Trump.

So what do you think?
I find it likely that individuals within the Trump administration do not like the man or respect him as an individual. This has overcome the respect the office garners to the extent that when he says or proposes things that may be seen as detrimental or damaging to the country people are compelled to tell others out of concern and disgust.
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Old August 9th, 2017, 05:37 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by tecoyah View Post
when he says or proposes things that may be seen as detrimental or damaging to the country people are compelled to tell others out of concern and disgust.

in our partisan political climate, most see their opponents as proposing "detrimental an/or damaging things for the country".

So are leaks fair play if you feel your political opponent is proposing something wrong for your country?

Is that the broad criteria making leaks Ok?
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Old August 9th, 2017, 05:42 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arcturus88 View Post
So if you watch the news you are aware of the many leaks occurring at or relating to the White House and President Trump.
As much as I like Mr. Trump and his entourage of intellectually challenged neophytes I think these “leaker” or “unnamed sources” within the White House should shut up and do their jobs. They serve the office of the President thus they should show respect to the office irrespective of what they think or feel. If they are not happy with the message or the office they should resign otherwise they are just frauds.
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Old August 9th, 2017, 05:45 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arcturus88 View Post
in our partisan political climate, most see their opponents as proposing "detrimental an/or damaging things for the country".

So are leaks fair play if you feel your political opponent is proposing something wrong for your country?

Is that the broad criteria making leaks Ok?
I was unaware that Donald Trump staffed up with his opponents...not a smart thing to do. But yes, I would do whatever I could to prevent damage to my country.
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Old August 9th, 2017, 06:33 AM   #6
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Yes, he should get rid of them.
And replace them with who?

Very few people want to work for the guy, he is likely to stab in the back before he backs a bus over you.
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Old August 9th, 2017, 07:26 AM   #7
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And replace them with who?

Very few people want to work for the guy, he is likely to stab in the back before he backs a bus over you.
You stole my line!
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Old August 9th, 2017, 11:37 AM   #8
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I was unaware that Donald Trump staffed up with his opponents...not a smart thing to do. But yes, I would do whatever I could to prevent damage to my country.
The sticking point is of course "...damage to my country"
To some, any of these may fit that category:

- affordable health care
- capitalism
- pro-2nd Amendment
- abortion
- wars
- foreign aid
- "removing God from government"
- infringing on separation of church and state
- pro-illegal immigration policies
- anti-immigration policies
- free trade
- taxation without representation
- government programs
- etc...
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Old August 9th, 2017, 11:39 AM   #9
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I was unaware that Donald Trump staffed up with his opponents...not a smart thing to do. But yes, I would do whatever I could to prevent damage to my country.
note your rather different opinion about leaks when they ran counter to your particular political leanings:

Should Assange be eliminated?

please note:

I am not saying you are a hypocrite or that your moral compass begins and ends with Donald Trump.
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Last edited by arcturus88; August 9th, 2017 at 11:43 AM.
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Old August 9th, 2017, 11:41 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arcturus88 View Post
The sticking point is of course "...damage to my country"
To some, any of these may fit that category:

- affordable health care
- capitalism
- pro-2nd Amendment
- abortion
- wars
- foreign aid
- "removing God from government"
- infringing on separation of church and state
- pro-illegal immigration policies
- anti-immigration policies
- free trade
- taxation without representation
- government programs
- etc...
Attempting to confuse and distract is an ineffective and obvious tactic used by those with no valid argument.
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Old August 9th, 2017, 11:44 AM   #11
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Attempting to confuse and distract is an ineffective and obvious tactic used by those with no valid argument.
I'm taking you down a path to show you that your logical argument for leaking is anything but logical.
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Old August 9th, 2017, 12:23 PM   #12
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I'm taking you down a path to show you that your logical argument for leaking is anything but logical.
Okay lets play your game. Obviously every human on Earth has priorities that differ from every other. Politics fall under this as well and vary just as much. There are however certain aspects of the United States Constitution that are not up for debate and are considered sacred by "Patriotic" individuals. When these are compromised the reaction should be an attempt to prevent said compromise.
Though opinion certainly comes in to play in this, documented and clear data does as well. The office of the Presidency does not protect or excuse these actions and thus when they become an issue of concern they must be addressed. Choosing to ignore this or falling for the "Fake News" mantra is no excuse and if anything creates an impression of ignorance or disregard for what this country was founded on.
In short, there are many things this President does or says that run counter to hundreds of years of tradition and freedoms and decades of modern societal advancement. He also has fraudulent and dishonest tendencies well documented and verified by multiple sources and legal institutions. He has soiled the office and degraded the country both domestically and internationally.

For these reasons and others I would definitely "Leak" if he tried to do further damage.
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Old August 9th, 2017, 01:00 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by Aufgeblassen View Post
Ummm..... He is AGAINST leaking. How did you FAIL to see that?
Your reading comprehension and ability to understand complex conversation makes it clear that you should not step into the adult room.
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Old August 9th, 2017, 10:57 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by Aufgeblassen View Post
You comments shows you are quite clueless about the subject at hand!
You of course refer to the subject I have been discussing extensively in this thread until you decided to "drop in" and derail the discussion with your usual pointless diatribe?
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Old August 10th, 2017, 06:26 AM   #15
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you are narrowing your focus and that is good in my opinion. Previously, you argued for leaks based on proposals seen as detrimental or damaging to the country. very subjective and broad as anyone could say this of any president and likely have.

However, below you argue (correctly in my opinion) that a righteous cause for dissent, which may include leaks, would be based on a president whose actions run counter to or tear down the rights within the Constitution:


Quote:
There are however certain aspects of the United States Constitution that are not up for debate and are considered sacred by "Patriotic" individuals. When these are compromised the reaction should be an attempt to prevent said compromise.
Bravo to you on that!
Unfortunately, your argument then veers off the rails of righteousness and lands full on in a dung heap of subjective opinion, completely unrelated to actions against the Constitution:


Quote:
In short, there are many things this President does or says that run counter to hundreds of years of tradition and freedoms and decades of modern societal advancement. He also has fraudulent and dishonest tendencies well documented and verified by multiple sources and legal institutions. He has soiled the office and degraded the country both domestically and internationally.

For these reasons and others I would definitely "Leak" if he tried to do further damage.

Last edited by arcturus88; August 10th, 2017 at 06:29 AM.
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Old August 10th, 2017, 06:47 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arcturus88 View Post
you are narrowing your focus and that is good in my opinion. Previously, you argued for leaks based on proposals seen as detrimental or damaging to the country. very subjective and broad as anyone could say this of any president and likely have.

However, below you argue (correctly in my opinion) that a righteous cause for dissent, which may include leaks, would be based on a president whose actions run counter to or tear down the rights within the Constitution:


Bravo to you on that!
Unfortunately, your argument then veers off the rails of righteousness and lands full on in a dung heap of subjective opinion, completely unrelated to actions against the Constitution:
The areas you say I am "Veering" are the opinions that direct my values. These will obviously differ from your own but are based very much on my reading of the Constitution. It is because of these values that you believe me to be a liberal Democrat but, they are the values once held by the Republican Party as documented by everyone who remembers Ronald Reagan.
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Old August 10th, 2017, 08:51 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tecoyah View Post
These will obviously differ from your own but are based very much on my reading of the Constitution.
Just curious, what would that be the constitutional element of your thought process?
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Old August 10th, 2017, 08:56 AM   #18
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When you are employed by the White House are you bound by a gag clause in your employment contract? I would assume the higher up you are the more you are bound by some form of classified secrets act or whatever it's called?
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Old August 10th, 2017, 09:40 AM   #19
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When you are employed by the White House are you bound by a gag clause in your employment contract? I would assume the higher up you are the more you are bound by some form of classified secrets act or whatever it's called?
Leaks by definition are a violation of gag orders and classification. It wouldn't be a leak if you could freely talk about it.
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Old August 10th, 2017, 10:10 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by Aufgeblassen View Post
You're all wet! An understood rule is not a gag order.
And you cannot leak from a "Rule".
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