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-   -   discovering death (http://politicalfray.com/philosophy/3946-discovering-death.html)

arcturus88 June 19th, 2013 02:39 PM

discovering death
 
so when did you discover, realize, or otherwise come to understand about death?:skull: was there a specifc incident that ocurred? death of relative, etc.? How old were you and how did it hit you when you realized the ramifications?


For me, i had several instances that brought it home as a child.

1. age 3 or 4. i had captured a grasshopper under a styrofoam cup. forgot about it then later jumped out of a tree and landed on the cup (partially intentionally) when i looked under the lil fella had passed. i cried at what i had done.


2. age 4. watching tv i learned that the real smokey bear had died. somehow i instantly realized that this meant one day my parents would die. i was very upset about this realization.

3. age 5. grandfather died. i remember witnessing how upset others were at this and the sense of loss and finality that seemed present with them.

tecoyah June 19th, 2013 03:24 PM

In my opinion...not understanding death by age 20...designates a limited understanding of life. All things will die...deal with it.

arcturus88 June 19th, 2013 04:05 PM

ok...but what about you? when / how did you discover it?

tecoyah June 19th, 2013 05:00 PM

I would place is around 14, when I was removed from Holy Family Catholic school and began to deal with the realities on science after watching "Cosmos". In my ignorant youth I began to question aspects of biblical teachings the Nuns thought important....and was shall we say, reprimanded.
Fortunately, this removal from the flock allowed me to pursue things no longer limited by dogmatic thought.

David June 20th, 2013 02:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tecoyah (Post 43418)
In my opinion...not understanding death by age 20...designates a limited understanding of life. All things will die...deal with it.

I'm not so sure anymore. Immortality seems to be at hand.

Road Warrior June 21st, 2013 03:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David (Post 43431)
I'm not so sure anymore. Immortality seems to be at hand.

Doubtful. We can prolong life, but not make it immortal. People will still die from accidents or intentional killing. Even if we came up with a way to transplant brains into freshly cloned bodies, those same brains are subject to the laws of the Universe and human physiology.

arcturus88 June 21st, 2013 12:21 PM

But gentlemen, the question at hand...

Do you recall when you discovered death?

David June 21st, 2013 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Road Warrior (Post 43446)
Doubtful. We can prolong life, but not make it immortal. People will still die from accidents or intentional killing. Even if we came up with a way to transplant brains into freshly cloned bodies, those same brains are subject to the laws of the Universe and human physiology.

Biological immortality. True immortality is impossible, even the universe is mortal.

Road Warrior June 21st, 2013 06:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David (Post 43450)
Biological immortality. True immortality is impossible, even the universe is mortal.

Like I posted, we are a long way from being able to replace brains. Maybe we can prolong our lives several extra decades, but I think the brain will eventually collapse....figuratively speaking.

David June 22nd, 2013 08:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Road Warrior (Post 43455)
Like I posted, we are a long way from being able to replace brains. Maybe we can prolong our lives several extra decades, but I think the brain will eventually collapse....figuratively speaking.

A long way off if your order, anyone born after '85 and in good health, baring unnatural misfortune, is liable to still be alive and kicking when immortality comes along. We already have computers that can learn and we're only a few years off from simulating a cat's brain (and about a decade or 2 from a monkey's). The real trick in nanotech. If you could create a cybernetic equivalent to a neuron, a gradual switching out of brain cells with the tech (thus never interrupting brain functions and maintaining the original personality) would allow you to replace our organic brain making your argument irrelevant. That's a long way off but life extension could keep a young person alive and healthy long enough to see/use the necessary breakthroughs.

Road Warrior June 23rd, 2013 05:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David (Post 43463)
A long way off if your order, anyone born after '85 and in good health, baring unnatural misfortune, is liable to still be alive and kicking when immortality comes along. We already have computers that can learn and we're only a few years off from simulating a cat's brain (and about a decade or 2 from a monkey's). The real trick in nanotech. If you could create a cybernetic equivalent to a neuron, a gradual switching out of brain cells with the tech (thus never interrupting brain functions and maintaining the original personality) would allow you to replace our organic brain making your argument irrelevant. That's a long way off but life extension could keep a young person alive and healthy long enough to see/use the necessary breakthroughs.

So you are predicting immortality by 2065ish? Awesome.

As it is, there's a lot of "ifs" in there. Additionally, embedding a person's personality into a machine would be very interesting not to mention quite a feat.

It also brings up the idea of what defines a sentient intelligence. I suspect we're a lot closer to creating a truly artificial intelligence, a sentient being, than being able to fully transfer human personalities into a computer.

David June 23rd, 2013 06:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Road Warrior (Post 43466)
So you are predicting immortality by 2065ish? Awesome.

As it is, there's a lot of "ifs" in there. Additionally, embedding a person's personality into a machine would be very interesting not to mention quite a feat.

It also brings up the idea of what defines a sentient intelligence. I suspect we're a lot closer to creating a truly artificial intelligence, a sentient being, than being able to fully transfer human personalities into a computer.

I didn't say anything about transferring, we'll pull it off at some point I'm sure but I give it 90+ years. What I'm talking about is nuron mimicking nanobots gradually replacing organic cells until the brain in completely cybernetic. I'd imagine an injection every year for several decades with the nanobots using the organic material to replicate. 2065 isn't unreasonable if quantum computing follows Moore's Law.

arcturus88 June 25th, 2013 10:34 AM

it seems folk are so afraid of death that they'd rather discuss the possibility of man-made immortality that discuss their own personal experience with discovering death.

oh well, carry on.

don't worry...everything is going to be fine.

Road Warrior June 25th, 2013 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by arcturus88 (Post 43505)
it seems folk are so afraid of death that they'd rather discuss the possibility of man-made immortality that discuss their own personal experience with discovering death.

oh well, carry on.

don't worry...everything is going to be fine.

Good point. It's often said that the greatest fear of all is fear of the unknown. Fear of death and what lies beyond, if anything, would be the greatest unknown.

From the Alan Watts "Out of Your Mind" series:

BORKED

David June 25th, 2013 06:24 PM

Death doesn't really bother me (though I'll fight tooth and nail to keep it at bay, I like living), it's the dying part, the transition, that keeps me up at night (literally).

Road Warrior June 26th, 2013 02:08 AM

Odds are you'll die with a lot of pain killers in you: FASTSTATS - Leading Causes of Death

http://www.castlenofear.com/Smileys/...rim_reaper.gif

arcturus88 February 6th, 2014 10:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aufgeblassen (Post 43646)
I cannot remember... sorry!!!

Try.

Polydectes February 6th, 2014 06:07 PM

I discovered death art the age of 5 my beloved dog died. She was a German Shepard only a few weeks older than me. My neighbor had been poisoning birds and she ate a few of them and was secondaryily poisoned. She died shortly after having puppies. We kept the runt.

arcturus88 February 7th, 2014 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aufgeblassen (Post 48375)
I guess when my dad died when I was 7. I heard it from a neighbor kid on my way home from school, and I don't think I believed him.

I guess I knew my dad was sick, because one time coming home from our summer cottage in Wisconsin, I (vaguely) remember he had to pull over & let my mom drive, because he was unable to continue.

you win. you have the saddest, most poignant story for this thread.
thank you for sharing it.

Polydectes February 7th, 2014 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aufgeblassen (Post 48397)
Okie dokie. When I was older (maybe 14ish), I killed an innocent bird with my BB gun, and I felt really bad about it. :cry:

Really? When I was 19 I killed a rabbit rippedit's guts and skin out cooked and ate it's flesh. I thought it was pretty cool that I learned how to do that.


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