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Old January 15th, 2010, 09:54 PM   #1
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Do you believe in the existence of atheists?

I always had a sense that God existed as I grew up. Then I started reading the bible when I was around ten and it had the distinct ring of truth to it which let me to further study and observation and eventually I became reconciled with God.

A while back I heard someone say that they didn't believe that anyone was truly atheist. I pondered that a bit and concluded that there are some that want me to believe that they don't believe God exists but the reality is that they sense he exists but wished he did not exist. Therefore, I don't believe in the existence of atheists.

Do you believe in the existence of atheists?
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Old January 15th, 2010, 09:58 PM   #2
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[COLOR=Purple]Since I believe in faith, I'd have to trust that someone who claims to be an atheist truly feels that way, and lives their life that way- I don't think it's wise to assume that all people who claim to be atheist are just wishing there wasn't a God. If you do believe in God and study the bible you must come across passages that say something like .. beware of non-believers?

I'm not atheist, nor am I christian. I had been Christian as a child and do remember being told often to watch out for those with no faith in God.. so.. I guess that can lead only to the conclusion that atheism is a REAL thing.

Last edited by WanderingStar; January 15th, 2010 at 10:20 PM.
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Old January 15th, 2010, 10:10 PM   #3
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I do believe that atheists exist- we even have some on this very forum. People like to believe in what makes sense to them and there are certainly people- especially many of science backgrounds- who do not believe the idea of God makes sense.

The idea that atheists don't "exist" because those who claim to be atheist simply don't want God to exist is really a very weak argument. It can be turned around just as easily to question whether true believers "exist" only because they want a God to exist.
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Old January 15th, 2010, 10:24 PM   #4
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I believe we all have a sense of God's existence. I sensed it by the existence of my conscience and also through the complexity of biological life. I often wonder how many self proclaimed atheists would cry out to God in some dire time.

If a plane full of atheists started to go out of control and was going to crash, I wonder how many would cry out to what they say is a non-existent being. It reminds me of the saying "there are no atheists in fox holes".
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Old January 15th, 2010, 10:32 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CreaseMonkeyDotCom View Post
I believe we all have a sense of God's existence. I sensed it by the existence of my conscience and also through the complexity of biological life. I often wonder how many self proclaimed atheists would cry out to God in some dire time.

If a plane full of atheists started to go out of control and was going to crash, I wonder how many would cry out to what they say is a non-existent being. It reminds me of the saying "there are no atheists in fox holes".
The thing is, while you may feel the existence of good in your conscience, everyone may not be the same way. After all, there is a scientific explanation to conscience which is driven by chemical reactions.

Personally, I do believe a God exists, but I have come to that conclusion based on a logical explanation that makes sense to me. I do not believe in many of the rituals of religion, but I do believe there was some higher force that created all of this for one reason or another.

But, again it is driven by what makes sense to one. Everyone does not have that same feeling of a connection between your conscious and a God. As for your thought experiment on atheists calling out to God- let me turn that around to ask you how many people also lose faith in God during crisis.
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Old January 15th, 2010, 11:06 PM   #6
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As for your thought experiment on atheists calling out to God- let me turn that around to ask you how many people also lose faith in God during crisis.
Good question but I would argue that if faith can't weather a crisis it isn't true faith.
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Old January 16th, 2010, 05:56 AM   #7
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God is not as popular as in times past. The biblical representation is rather forbidding and out of date. One would think that, given human nature, God would be more forgiving and lovable for being so demanding of man?s adulation. W. Somerset Maugham said that he found it difficult to believe in a god that was less compassionate and tolerant of human failings than he was himself. In his autobiography, he wrote: "Men are passionate, men are weak, men are stupid, men are pitiful; to bring to bear on them anything so tremendous as the wrath of God seems strangely inept." W. Somerset Maugham, The Summing Up (1938).

Jesus is a more sympathetic character, but cuts a rather poor figure as a god. (Real gods are not supposed to die, even if they manage to be resurrected.) Somehow the man who preached the Sermon on the Mount seems more impressive than Christ the miracle worker. Still, anyone who could turn water into wine would have been worth inviting to a party.

The philosopher Epictetus once said that it was incumbent to acknowledge the existence of the gods and make sacrifice to them. Epictetus (Arrian), The Enchiridion, XXXI (A.D. 135). Indeed, what would they be otherwise but dead statues? For it is not what adorns the temple, but he who worships and adores it that makes the divinity.

Perhaps, rather than issuing commandments that every one believe in Him, God would do better with a good publicist.
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Old January 16th, 2010, 07:16 AM   #8
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God is not as popular as in times past. The biblical representation is rather forbidding and out of date. One would think that, given human nature, God would be more forgiving and lovable for being so demanding of man?s adulation. W. Somerset Maugham said that he found it difficult to believe in a god that was less compassionate and tolerant of human failings than he was himself. In his autobiography, he wrote: "Men are passionate, men are weak, men are stupid, men are pitiful; to bring to bear on them anything so tremendous as the wrath of God seems strangely inept." W. Somerset Maugham, The Summing Up (1938).

Jesus is a more sympathetic character, but cuts a rather poor figure as a god. (Real gods are not supposed to die, even if they manage to be resurrected.) Somehow the man who preached the Sermon on the Mount seems more impressive than Christ the miracle worker. Still, anyone who could turn water into wine would have been worth inviting to a party.

The philosopher Epictetus once said that it was incumbent to acknowledge the existence of the gods and make sacrifice to them. Epictetus (Arrian), The Enchiridion, XXXI (A.D. 135). Indeed, what would they be otherwise but dead statues? For it is not what adorns the temple, but he who worships and adores it that makes the divinity.

Perhaps, rather than issuing commandments that every one believe in Him, God would do better with a good publicist.
Ummm, were you quoting W. Phillips Plagiarist or did he go back in time and post your work on another forum?
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Old January 16th, 2010, 07:33 AM   #9
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I am Wendell Phillips, W.J. Wilczek and others.
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Old January 17th, 2010, 06:29 AM   #10
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I am an atheist.

If a God did exist, i would wish it wouldn't. Sure. On the other hand, if it did exist, then he could do some brilliant things. So maybe in some senses i regret its non-existence - the things it could have done. As i feel with the state - i wish it wouldn't exist, but i'm glad for the existence of the NHS (I live in Britain).

However, any logical reasoning tells me that he doesn't exist. It seems a ridiculous idea to me. There was a time, when i was young, naive - and naturally, never wrong - when i believed in the Judeo-Christian God. It's just i've grown out of fairytales since then.

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Old January 17th, 2010, 07:38 AM   #11
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Well you must be about the only one here. As slow as this board is this morning the rest must be in church.
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Old January 17th, 2010, 06:47 PM   #12
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Well you must be about the only one here. As slow as this board is this morning the rest must be in church.
You're assuming that everyone's Christian. A Jew would go missing on Saturday and a Muslim on Friday.
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Old January 17th, 2010, 08:29 PM   #13
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You're assuming that everyone's Christian. A Jew would go missing on Saturday and a Muslim on Friday.
I never assume anything. The world is too screwed up for that.
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Old January 17th, 2010, 10:01 PM   #14
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I never assume anything. The world is too screwed up for that.
The world? the UNIVERSE is screwed up.
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Old January 18th, 2010, 01:40 AM   #15
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The world? the UNIVERSE is screwed up.
I don't agree. The Universe is perfect. It is our thinking that is screwed up.
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Old January 18th, 2010, 08:48 AM   #16
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I don't agree. The Universe is perfect. It is our thinking that is screwed up.
Perfect? The whole place is 1 giant paradox.
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Old January 18th, 2010, 09:13 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by CreaseMonkeyDotCom View Post
I often wonder how many self proclaimed atheists would cry out to God in some dire time.

If a plane full of atheists started to go out of control and was going to crash, I wonder how many would cry out to what they say is a non-existent being. It reminds me of the saying "there are no atheists in fox holes".
I'd probably be yelling Jesus Christ or something of the sort, but it certainly wouldn't be asking for help.

The whole idea of prayer and miracles is one of the things which makes the LEAST sense in religion. It's just a big joke really.
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Old January 19th, 2010, 05:52 PM   #18
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I don't agree. The Universe is perfect. It is our thinking that is screwed up.
People are a part of the universe.
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Old January 19th, 2010, 07:54 PM   #19
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People are a part of the universe.
A product, not a part. Take us out and put us in a new universe and as long as the laws of physics allow for our existence we'll be fine as would the universe we currently reside in. Now take away something like gravity...
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Old January 20th, 2010, 01:28 AM   #20
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People are a part of the universe.
Right, but their thinking puts them on the wrong track and separates them from the Universe. They may even be deluded how they fit into the universe.
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