What Right Do Zionist Jews Have To Palestine?

Sep 2011
21
0
In French Canada.
[SIZE=+4]What Right Do Zionist
Jews Have To Palestine?
[SIZE=+1]
From Jason Collett
[email protected] [SIZE=+1]11-9-3

[SIZE=+1]What title-deeds do the Jews of today actually have to the land of 'Israel'? The idea that a people can possess some kind of ethnic ancestral right to a territory supposedly vacated by their forebears some millenia previously, implying a right in perpetuity, can have no legal basis. Or otherwise Americans of European ancestry, to name just one group of people, will have to pack their bags. [SIZE=+1]According to Dr Alfred Lilienthal in his book The Zionist Connection, "The Jewish population of Palestine [what is now Israel and the occupied territories, the West Bank and Gaza] at the time of the Balfour Declaration in 1917 was a mere 7 percent of the 700 000 inhabitants. The rest were Muslim and Christian Arabs?At the time of the (US-dominated UN) partition vote in 1947 there were only 650 000 Jews in Palestine while there were 1,3 million indigenous Palestinian Arabs, either Christian or Muslim. Under the partition plan, 56 % of Palestine was given for a Zionist state to people who constituted 33 % of the population and owned about 6 % [six percent] of the land? These UN figures have never been in dispute?" [SIZE=+1]But there is a further issue, which also (YET AGAIN!) demonstrates the fundamentally questionable foundations of Zionism. [SIZE=+1]Jews are actually not even the modern descendents of the Israel of the Biblical ?Old Testament?: [SIZE=+1]According to both the early-20th-Century popular historian H.G.Wells and the Hungarian-Jewish intellectual and author Arthur Koestler, amongst numerous others, the people known today as Jews are primarily the descendents of a Turkish tribe known as the Khazars. The Khazars have no historical connection to Palestine. They converted to ?Judaism? between 620 and 740AD, and have no genetic connection to biblical Israel, and hence to the narratives of the Bible and the ?Holy Land?. Koestler actually devoted an entire book called The Thirteenth Tribe (1976) to the fact that the Jews of eastern European origin, who are known as the Ashkenazi Jews and who make up about 95% of the Jewish population of today, are of Khazar origin. In other words - virtually all of the Jews of the modern world have no Hebrew ancestry, and no ancient connection with Palestine. [SIZE=+1]Does it matter? Does world peace matter? Do the human rights of a violently oppressed people matter? Does anything but sport and television sitcoms matter? [SIZE=+1]Arthur Koestler was by no means the first to draw attention to this particular issue. He quotes from twentieth-century works on the subject by, amongst others, Professors A.N.Poliak of Tel Aviv University, D.M.Dunlop of Columbia University in New York, and J.B.Bury of Cambridge University. The courageous Jewish anti-Zionist commentator Dr Alfred Lilienthal raised the issue fifty years ago and has continued to do so for decades. In fact, the famous H.G.Wells in the early 1920?s in his popular Outline of History described the Jews as ?a Turkish people? and stated that ?(to the) Jewish Khazars.. are to be ascribed the great settlements of Jews in Poland and Russia? (chapt XXXII:8) and ?The main part of Jewry never was in Judea, and never came out of Judea? (XXIX:1). [SIZE=+1]Lord Moyne the British secretary of state in Cairo declared on June 9, 1942, in the House of Lords that the Jews were not the descendants of the ancient Hebrews and that they had no "legitimate claim" on the Holy Land. A proponent of curtailing immigration into Palestine, he was accused of being "an implacable enemy of Hebrew independence."(Isaac Zaar, Rescue and Liberation: America's Part in the Birth of Israel, New York: Bloch, 1954, p. 115). On November 6, 1944, Lord Moyne was assassinated in Cairo by two members of the Stern Gang led by Yitzak Shamir, latter to become premier of ?Israel?. (This assassination was not unique in the history of Zionism. In September 1948 Count Folke Bernadotte, appointed by the UN as mediator between the Zionist settlers in Palestine and the native Palestinians, was murdered on orders from the same Yitzhak Shamir. Count Bernadotte was the head of the Swedish Red Cross and had risked his life to save thousands of Jews from German concentration camps. This set a precedent and encouragement for the Zionist use of assassination as a convenient political instrument, which the US and European governments have in effect condoned since then.) [SIZE=+1]Much old documentary evidence exists on the subject of the Khazars dating from the ninth and tenth centuries and earlier - from Arab, Byzantine, Hebrew, Russian and other sources. The conversion of the Khazars to Judaism is described in the so-called 'Khazar Correspondence' dating from the tenth century between Hasdai Ibn Shaprut, the Jewish chief minister of the Caliph of Cordoba in Spain, and Joseph, the king of the Khazars. In this the king traces the ancestry of his people not to Shem, father of the Semites, but to Japheth, Noah's third son. The Book of Genesis (10:2,3) itself also describes Ashkenaz as a descendent of Japheth, rather than Shem. In other words, the Jews are not a Semitic people, but their contempt for the Arab world and their bitter and violent war of dispossession against the Palestinian Arabs could be termed ?anti-Semitic?. [SIZE=+1]The Khazars were formerly well known as a powerful people who, at their peak, 'controlled or exacted tribute from some thirty different nations and tribes' (Koestler), and were the supreme masters of the southern half of eastern Europe for more than a century. The Caspian Sea is still known today in Arabic as Bahr-ul-Khazar, 'the Khazar Sea'. These people controlled trade on the Dnieper, the Don and Volga Rivers between the Swedish Vikings, known as the Rus (the founders of Russia) in the north, and Byzantium-Constantinople (capital of the Eastern Roman Empire), Persia and Arabia in the south. The extent of trade along these rivers is indicated by the very large number of Arab coins - approximately 50 000 ? found, strangely enough, in Sweden and dating from Viking times. [SIZE=+1]After their conversion to 'Judaism', a religion based primarily on the teachings of the Pharisees and the Talmud, the Khazars adopted circumcision and became known as the 'Jewish Khazars' and then later simply as 'Jews'.

read more part2
 
Sep 2011
21
0
In French Canada.
Part 2---Jews are khazars

[SIZE=+1]Before the conversion, the 'Jewish' population of the entire region was sparse; afterwards, understandably, it suddenly became large. Writing in the tenth century, the Muslim chronicler Muqaddasi says 'In Khazaria, sheep, honey and Jews exist in large quantities' (Koestler p 43). [SIZE=+1]After being defeated by the Rus around 965AD, the power of the Khazars waned, and a gradual migration commenced westwards and north-westwards into Eastern Europe - the Ukraine, Hungary, Poland and Lithuania. Koestler shows that Yiddish (the former Jewish lingua franca of eastern Europe which is classed as a German dialect) developed not in Germany but in Poland as an amalgam of German, Hebrew and Slavonic (Russian and Polish) - the strong German basis of the language being the result of the German social and cultural prominence in the main cities of Poland in medieval times (Koestler chapt VII : 3). Hebrew itself was only used for liturgical and rabbinic-scholastic purposes, not for everyday communication. No archaeological or other evidence exists of the use in biblical times of the six-pointed 'star of David', the emblem of the Ashkenazi Jews and the Israeli state, and the yarmulke, the skullcap worn by Jewish males, likewise has no biblical foundation. So neither the use of Hebrew nor the star of David, or the wearing of the yarmulke indicate any historical connection with the territory. [SIZE=+1]Koestler says: "The historical evidence.. indicates that the bulk of Eastern Jewry - and hence of world Jewry - is of Khazar-Turkish, rather than Semitic, origin." [SIZE=+1](p 175). This of course poses various interesting questions on many issues, including that of the violent and manipulative Jewish takeover of Palestine during the last century. The reason these questions are not asked is that the story of the Khazar conversion is generally so little known. The academic, church and media establishments generally have shown no interest in correcting such an awkward and fundamental misperception, the source of so much suffering and spilt blood. They consider the issue to be unimportant or potentially dangerous in spite of the shocking human-rights outrages that the mainly Khazar-descended 'Israelis' and their Khazar-descended international Zionist supporters have perpetrated against the native people in Palestine over the last century. [SIZE=+1]Is there any doubt about the issue? [SIZE=+1]The British journalist Douglas Reed, former chief Central European correspondent of the Times, in 1950 wrote "The Eastern European Zionists are not Semites (though the Arabs are), have no semitic blood, and their remote forefathers never trod Palestinian earth." [SIZE=+1]Mr Benjamin Freedman, a Jewish industrialist born in New York, wrote in the Economic Council Letter published there of October 15 1947: "These Eastern European Jews have neither a racial nor a historic connection with Palestine. Their ancestors were not inhabitants of the Promised Land. They are the direct descendants of the people of the Khazar Kingdom.. The Khazars were a non-semitic, Turko-Mongolian tribe." [SIZE=+1]Mr Freedman was challenged, unwisely, by a Zionist objector. He invited his challenger to go with him to the Jewish room of the New York Public Library. There they could together examine the Jewish Encyclopaedia volume I pp. 1-12, and the published works of Graetz, Dubnow, Friedlander, Raisin and many other noted Jewish historians, which, as well as other non-Jewish authorities, "establish the fact beyond all possible doubt." (Somewhere South of Suez (1950) pp349-350). [SIZE=+1]If the Khazar account is untrue, we can be sure that a swift and comprehensive rebuttal would have followed Koestler's book and Lilienthal's long-standing allegations, let alone those of H.G.Wells. Can anyone name the book or books in which such a rebuttal appeared? [SIZE=+1]To confuse the Jews of today with the Hebrews of the Bible is like believing that the Cherokee 'Indians' not only follow the Hindu religion but will eventually return in triumph to the valley of the sacred Ganges?
 
Aug 2011
448
0
California
Wow, I have never seen so much nonsense in such a large font.
Every country has a right to defend themselves. Its your precious UN that established a Jewish state, and all her neighbors have been trying to destroy her ever since. Besides, there is no Palesitine. Palestine is a myth.
 
Sep 2011
21
0
In French Canada.
Wow, I have never seen so much nonsense in such a large font.
Every country has a right to defend themselves. Its your precious UN that established a Jewish state, and all her neighbors have been trying to destroy her ever since. Besides, there is no Palesitine. Palestine is a myth.

Israel was created by the UN because Jew financed the elections
of Truman.
Israel is an agressor state...Its crimes disgusted the world.
Israel is a myth....Khazars who converted to Judaism because
of the Talmud, that permits the father to have sex with his son under 5..

Christians including Catholics in Jerusalem Jews spit on Christians
during procession --see the Toronto Star.
 
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Aug 2011
448
0
California
Toranto Star! LOL. How about Pravda while I am at it?

There is no Palestine, except in the minds of Liberal anti-Semitic hate mongers.
 
Aug 2011
448
0
California
And there was no Israel until the UN made it up.

Really? So all the historical documents about King David, King Solomon, the writings of Josephus, etc. etc., are all a lie?

Is there any depth that you anti-Semitic people won't stoop too?

What a joke: The people who accuse Republicans of not believing in science are the same people who tear up history
 
Jul 2009
5,893
474
Port St. Lucie
Really? So all the historical documents about King David, King Solomon, the writings of Josephus, etc. etc., are all a lie?

Is there any depth that you anti-Semitic people won't stoop too?

What a joke: The people who accuse Republicans of not believing in science are the same people who tear up history

The Hebrews/Israelites were Semitic, the Israelis are Indo-European and Turkish. So yes, Israel as it exists today is made up, this is't even in dispute, I only like to brig it up when someone makes the "there is no Palestine" argument.
 
Apr 2009
1,943
5
Disunited Queendom
The Hebrews/Israelites were Semitic, the Israelis are Indo-European and Turkish. So yes, Israel as it exists today is made up, this is't even in dispute, I only like to brig it up when someone makes the "there is no Palestine" argument.

The Israelis of today are descended from Semites of the Middle East - that much has been genetically proven through experiments on Ashkenazi, Sephardi and Mizrahi Jews. It's actually through a discovery in the field of genetics known as "the Israel gene".

Before 1948, the land that became Israel was the British Colonial Mandate of Palestine. It was ruled, often unfairly, by the British Empire, which caused divisions between Muslims and Jews (Divide And Conquer). The Establishment was racist and anti-Semitic. Israel is a revolutionary success story of overcoming colonial imperialists and building a socialist state, with freedom and equality for all.

The modern State of Israel has three different legal mandates for existence. The Peel Commission's findings, the Balfour Declaration and the Declaration of Independence. The Declaration of Independence is the most valid because under international law, self-determination is the most important factor. In any case, it is ideal, because there were no states in the area at the time anyway. The British Mandate ran out in 1948.

The United Nations did indeed make an offer in 1947 to create two separate states. The Zionist grouping accepted it, but the Arab grouping declined it. In any case, when the State was declared, it was attacked from all sides. The new State of Israel won all of its land subsequently through Just Conquest" in self-defence, which is recognised in International Law. This excludes Judea and Samaria, which were illegally occupied by Jordan.

A few years previous to the Declaration, there was a "Palestine" stall set up in London, incidentally. It was run by Zionist Jews campaigning for a State of Israel.

Originally, the idea was to give the whole of the British Mandate "to the Jews". This was dropped and in 1922 (I think), an Arab state was formed from two thirds of the area. It became known as Jordan. Palestinian nationalism was not prominent at any point preceding 1967.

Before Britain, the Palestinian Mandate was part of the Ottoman Empire - it was ceded to Britain after the First World War. Before that, it was a part of the Assyrian Empire. Before that, it belonged to the Roman Empire, which, when they acquired it, renamed it "Palestina" after the ancient enemies of the Jews, which weren't around anymore. It was an insult. Before that, it was run by the Jews.

Modern Arabs in the area, which from 1967 onwards, identified themselves as "Palestinians", have ancestors from Cyprus, Turkey and elsewhere in the Middle East. A very small minority today have ancestors from modern-day Israel. The current President of the Palestinian Authority (set up by the State of Israel) is Abu Mazen/Mahmoud Abbas, who was born in Cairo (Egypt). About 80% of people in the Disputed Territories (Judea and Samaria) hold Jordanian citizenship.

Look comrade, I am a supporter of a Palestinian state in the Disputed Territories as well. But don't falsify history to support our point. It makes it look like the case for a Palestinian State needs to be based on historical misunderstanding. And be careful of wherever you picked up your conspiracy theory, by the way.
 
Mar 2009
2,751
6
Undisclosed
I should stay out of this one, but here goes.

In my opinion this will never be settled. Both sides teach the same hate generation after generation. So they will never agree. And the good old USA will use the veto to stop the world from settling it.

So it seems to me they keep doing the same things and expecting different results.
 
Apr 2009
1,943
5
Disunited Queendom
I should stay out of this one, but here goes.

In my opinion this will never be settled. Both sides teach the same hate generation after generation. So they will never agree. And the good old USA will use the veto to stop the world from settling it.

So it seems to me they keep doing the same things and expecting different results.

I think it's probably important to define what the two sides are, though. It is not as hopeless as may be thought. 80% of Israelis and 72% of Arabs in the Disputed Territories want a two-state solution. So any hate that is taught is clearly not enough to divert the people of Israel and the Disputed Territories from seeking a peaceful solution.

On the Israeli side, the education system teaches tolerance, acceptance and respect. Since Israeli society is extremely diverse, this is reflected on any information regarding the conflict. The problem in Israel are the right-wing "Settlers", who exacerbate the situation. The rhetoric from them is usually not based on the values in the rest of society and are largely inflammatory. Something I have serious issue with is the subsidisation of "Settler" housing, while other housing prices skyrocket for ordinary Israelis.

On the side of the Palestinian Authority, the problem is racism. The education system teaches a false history and anti-Semitic books are widespread. Which includes Mein Kampf, by the way, which is 6th of the best-selling list of the Palestinian Authority. While the State of Israel has made many peace proposals, the Palestinian Authority have not accepted one. The Government, I should add, is far more a problem than the people.
 
Mar 2009
2,751
6
Undisclosed
I think it's probably important to define what the two sides are, though. It is not as hopeless as may be thought. 80% of Israelis and 72% of Arabs in the Disputed Territories want a two-state solution. So any hate that is taught is clearly not enough to divert the people of Israel and the Disputed Territories from seeking a peaceful solution.

On the Israeli side, the education system teaches tolerance, acceptance and respect. Since Israeli society is extremely diverse, this is reflected on any information regarding the conflict. The problem in Israel are the right-wing "Settlers", who exacerbate the situation. The rhetoric from them is usually not based on the values in the rest of society and are largely inflammatory. Something I have serious issue with is the subsidisation of "Settler" housing, while other housing prices skyrocket for ordinary Israelis.

On the side of the Palestinian Authority, the problem is racism. The education system teaches a false history and anti-Semitic books are widespread. Which includes Mein Kampf, by the way, which is 6th of the best-selling list of the Palestinian Authority. While the State of Israel has made many peace proposals, the Palestinian Authority have not accepted one. The Government, I should add, is far more a problem than the people.
I do not disagree. But both seem to be trapped by their "leaders". And I am not really comfortable criticizing other governments while we are stuck with our pitiful leadership in our capital. And to be plain, I mean the whole damn crew!
 
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