It almost ended today. The protesters stormed the gates and even made it up the steps before loyalist riot police threw them back. I suspect that some MPs would have not come out of that alive if they had gotten inside. I've seen the videos, seems a lack of guns is the only thing stopping a civil war.
What is happening is the result of government guaranteeing what it can not and never will be able to provide. It is the result of overpowering unions, to the extent where they won't concede at all even when it means a bailout that is desperately needed.
I'm going to blame the capitalists for starting this for the same reason I blame them for bringing America to the brink. That said, the Greeks need to suck it up, go back to work and make the cuts. Ya it sucks but they can't be payed for. Starve or work until the economy recovers then start over.
How can you blame the capitalists when this debt crisis in Greece is the result of excessive government spending, which is the opposite of what capitalists would do? As for America, I think it is quite clear that it was moral hazard created by government that led to this crisis, not capitalism.
And I agree that they should accept the cuts, but traditionally, unions don't support them.
*growls*
We didn't support the bail outs, either, which are the reason for the deficit.
As a radical syndicalist, i'd like to point out i've no problem with things being cut, it's just what. And I think that most people would have a problem with public services being cut. Definitely in Greece.
(I will add, I came THIS close to making a Jewish joke there)
We didn't support the bail outs, either, which are the reason for the deficit.
As a radical syndicalist, i'd like to point out i've no problem with things being cut, it's just what. And I think that most people would have a problem with public services being cut. Definitely in Greece.
(I will add, I came THIS close to making a Jewish joke there)
Unions... The Greeks remind me why I hate or rather, loath them.
Most of us workers don't work in co-operatives. We need a platform to organise against the bosses, and ultimately, the state.
EDIT: I apologise if that came out overly militant and confrontational. I'm prepared to have a civil disagreement with my comrade.
Glad to know you're trying to stay civil Dirk, just try to keep the emotions from getting in the way. I think it should be noted that one can be anti-unions and pro-workers rights. I read a very interesting piece on unionization today that tackles virtually the same issue: http://www.campaignforliberty.com/article.php?view=827 Definitely worth checking out at the very least.
But that's just it, everyone should be able to work in a co-op (and preferably an all out soviet) if they wish. Direct worker control I advocate, unions tend to be as bad as the Bosses (UAW anyone?). If you took my post to be anti-labor, I apologize.
An interesting article but I must disagree. Even working in a worker-owned corporation (not quite a co-op but a good step) I see exploitation and unnecessary (for any reason other then more profit) cost cutting. The idea of no labor protections and workers subservient to the Bosses not resulting in horrible exploitation I find utterly fanciful. I mean has a union ever gotten the POTUS to order an air strike against the Bosses? I think not. It did happen the other way, however.
First off, no need for that tone. Second, unions are not as frowned upon in America as you may think- certain people may, but that is such in any nation. Third, at least consider the article I posted (and I promise you that Tom Woods is no where near the status quo, or "biased American" that you may think) before retorting.
All I am saying is that you do not have to be pro-union to be pro-workers rights. They are two different things and while you may see unions as the key to worker rights, others may not.
I agree that everyone should be able to work in a cooperative. And I consider unions to be an effective vehicle for social change in a multitude of senses. Industrial democracy and cooperatives are an agenda of all the good unions.
No particular tone, just providing an alternative source with an American focus, which I feel is far more neutrally presented.
You presume to know what I think. Interesting.
Actually, I get the feelings that in certain instances, unions will become more popular again, soon. I feel like the SWU is one of the best possible vanguards for new progress in the US.
Do you honestly think I stereotype that badly? I know he by no means represents the view of ordinary Americans. I read it, I understand it, thank you.
I would like to say that I have never claimed this. If you consider the main socialist contributors on this forum, you'll find that while I am massively in favour of democratic grassroots radical workers' unions, and consider myself, in principle, an anarcho-syndicalist, David expresses dislike for unions.
Well in that case, I encourage it. For the record though, I know my piece was biased- it is an op-ed, but just something that is relevant here.
Of course not. Looking back at your last post, I misunderstood what you were getting at. That one's on meYou presume to know what I think. Interesting.
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