Is the EU done for?

[myp]

A few months ago, I asked if the EU was in trouble ( http://www.politicalfray.com/showthread.php?t=1153 ). I think we all probably agree by now that it is. My next question is- is this the end for the EU?

Greece was first- saying they were fine, as bond yields continued to rise and eventually they realized they weren't. They took a bailout pushed by the ECB and IMF. Next it was Ireland- same story here except that they insisted they were fine even more than Greece had. They were the posterboys for austerity at work. It wasn't enough and they excepted a bailout this week. Now there are rumors of IMF/ECB pressure for Portgual to take a bailout in order to stop the big domino- Spain- from falling. Portugal insists they are fine.

All the while Germany is getting more annoyed with being stuck with bailout bills- as are taxpayers all over the EU. The anger is growing and bottling up as bailouts serve as the cap on the bottle. But the IMF and ECB just don't want to see anything fail and instead of letting defaults take care of things, they are trying to prop up a false prosperity. That can only go on for so long.

Do you guys think the end of the EU is near? Personally, I think it is quite possible and at the very least we will see a massive restructuring of how it operates and possibly a restructuring of the Euro currency as well.

 

[obtuseobserver]

The PIIGS are probably all going to fail. Two have.

The EU was intended to provide economic integration far all through centralized policy.

Greece employed (I forget which presently) an American accounting firm to provide the EU with documentation meeting the requirements for admission. All three were aware that there was gambling going on in there.

The despotic EU administration has robbed member states of economic sovereignty (granted they put themselves into bondage). I don't think the EU will fail because even though the people know they are in captivity the cultural confidence necessary to do anything is lost. Those with enough gumtion to actually do something will emigrate to the anglosphere and start over.

 

[David]

Western civilization is falling apart around us. China looks to be readying itself to kill the dollar (they just dropped it as their reserve currency) and the EU is heading for bankruptcy. Things are looking bad for the West and if things don't change I fear we'll end up some poor hellhole in the next 2 decades or so.

 

[obtuseobserver]

Western civilization is falling apart around us.

Western Europe is. Not western civilization. The most powerful states on the globe are still all Western. And don't start with China. They have nukes sure. They have lots of people sure. But they are poorer than the day is long. Their technology is decades behind us. They have NO blue water navy. They have massive internal discord amongst their large number of ethnicities. They cannot respond to emergeny events w/out outside help (Don't go to Katrina... the area effected was larger than Great Britain and outside of New Orleans - quite probably the most corrupt American city the event was handled much better than the MSM would lead you to believe).

China looks to be readying itself to kill the dollar (they just dropped it as their reserve currency) and the EU is heading for bankruptcy.

Interesting. So, if the EU is insolvent and China abandons the Dollar where are they going to go?

Too often too many lend too much importance to China. They are constantly on the verge of collapse. They must imprison people who advocate democracy. They gut Christianity and insert communist/statist theology into it before permitting it (people are not dumb - they understand the state's interference). They have tremendous conflict between rural and urban. Between rich and poor (don't compare to the US.... the richest Chinese is probably not quite as rich as the richest American but the Chinese poor are much much poorer and a billion people more - the rift if not compartable). Between ethnicities.. and not just angry jihadi Muslims but angry nationalist Muslims (just to nip in the bud... China is the largest contiguous land empire in the worls in the classic sense. China harbors, probably, greater ethnic diversity than any other state on the planet... one could argue Brazil but if you weight the individual members by population I'd bet on China... but I digress)

So.... sorry... where is this Chinese problem? They are going to start using Euros from the collapsing and bankrupt EU? If not... then what?

Things are looking bad for the West and if things don't change I fear we'll end up some poor hellhole in the next 2 decades or so.

well, we do have a debt of stupid proportions to fix

to count the future west - the anglosphere plus eastern europe, south korea, japan (and maybe a couple others) out would be foolish. We are inventive, reliable and have the resources to survive. Those states that are failing are those with dependent populations. Those that will succeed are those with self-r4liant populations. This is why the politics of the international left is surviving on life support and the plug will soon be pulled... elections in europe, SK and recently in the US point towards tightening one's belt and fixing the excesses of previous fools (of all political stripes - don't think for a second I'm letting the GOP off the hook)

 

[WillypHD]

Do you guys think the end of the EU is near? Personally, I think it is quite possible and at the very least we will see a massive restructuring of how it operates and possibly a restructuring of the Euro currency as well.

I would agree with you on this, I also see a restructuring of the EU, the Euro, and the Dollor in our future.

Scary eh?