Are our Two Parties really Conservative or Liberal?

Jan 2011
24
0
Nearly every time we turn on the news or radio and listen to someone party-loyalist blowhard talk about liberals or conservatives in a positive or negative light I am baffled. Baffled, because if you do maybe two or three minutes of reading, you will find that the ?liberals? and ?conservatives are supposed to mean Democrats and Republicans but the meanings of liberal and conservative match up poorly with their assumed counterpart parties.

In modern American politics, a traditional Republican is supposed to advocate for lower taxes, strong national defense, preservation or American moral traditions, and overall smaller government. Democrats then are advocates of bigger overall government, with somewhat higher taxes, more emphasis on social justice and opportunity, and less preservation of one culture?s values.

A person who is a truly a liberal in its classical sense is someone who is most generally against government intrusion into free enterprise and personal values decisions among groups and individuals ? essentially a Libertarian. A real conservative would then be against big government budgets of all kinds, but would also be a supporter of keeping traditional moral values in tact (pro-choice, anti-gay marriage, etc.) ? almost Theocratic. When you look at the actual orthodox political platforms of each of our major parties you begin to notice that each contains a liberal/conservative ying-yang within them, rather than being purely one or the other.

Modern Democrats justify the larger state with higher taxes to support social progressivism/liberalism. GOP supporters justify a smaller state and less tax to empower individual liberty. Neither is truly liberal or conservative, but are rather conflicting creeds that contradict their assumed modern day labels.

If you were truly conservative, you would not have advocated the massive development of government that occurred during the Bush administration with an additional government bureaucracy (dept. of Homeland Security), two expensive and perpetual wars, and the highest public education budget in our history to name just a few. The true liberals should rightfully be furious at President Obama?s ability to ignore the fact the racial profiling and both Patriot Acts continue to exist, and that our government in financially in bed with private banking institutions.

A Democrat is no more liberal than a Republican and a Republican no more conservative. Ideas of limited government and foreign intervention have not been preserved as advocated by the founders, and creating new ?rights? is no more freeing to citizens who are forced to pay for them.

In our current standing, it seems as if the hardest conservative is more of a Theocrat; and a hardest liberal is more of an pure Statist ? if their agendas where fully implemented. Liberalism and Conservatism have come to be known as something completely other than their original and classic meanings.

To be liberal is to be free thinking; to be conservative is to preserve traditions. This is why the usage of the terms ?liberal? and ?conservative to describe typical Democrats or Republicans is an irritating and most of all ignorant labeling of each. What we really have is a political oligopoly, a two-winged eagle that has a single head. The agendas put forth by both parties over the last few decades has been that of military growth, continued foreign intervention, additional rights (that must be paid by taxpayers somehow), and the monopoly of true political debate.
 
Aug 2010
211
12
Reynoldsburg, OH
globefront, et al,

I tend to think that these are obsolete terms and platform associations.

Nearly every time we turn on the news or radio and listen to someone party-loyalist blowhard talk about liberals or conservatives in a positive or negative light I am baffled. Baffled, because if you do maybe two or three minutes of reading, you will find that the ?liberals? and ?conservatives are supposed to mean Democrats and Republicans but the meanings of liberal and conservative match up poorly with their assumed counterpart parties.
(COMMENT)

While it is not my phrase, "party-loyalist blowhard(s)" it is about as applicable as any description I might make. They ALL seem to follow a utilitarian agenda.

People generally forget that a politician, by the nature of the animal, is a lower life form, two-steps or more below a hungry used car salesman that will tell you anything to sell you a car.

Listen, I'm a politician which means I'm a cheat and a liar, and when I'm not kissing babies I'm stealing their lollipops. But it also means I keep my options open.​

This is my all time favorite line of any movie. And, it is so true. And in our hearts, we Americans, know it is true. While serving is Washington may start out, for a young politician, to be about service, honor, country, the health and welfare of the nation, you will quickly find out that those are merely campaign slogans and not reality. Washington Politicians are not naive enough to actually believe that stuff. Only we believe that stuff, and we are the ones they call "naive," and "unsophisticated;" having a lack of experience and knowledge - unable to grasp the true nature of the situation.

It is about POWER. And when you see these little potentates strut around like imperial peacocks, self impressed by the echoes of their voice in the marbles halls of the fiefdom, you will immediately recognize them for what they have truly become.

In modern American politics,
  • A traditional Republican (Conservative) is supposed to advocate for lower taxes, strong national defense, preservation or American moral traditions, and overall smaller government.
  • Democrats (Liberal) then are advocates of bigger overall government, with somewhat higher taxes, more emphasis on social justice and opportunity, and less preservation of one culture?s values.
(COMMENT)

This might have been true in bye gone years, but not now. It is about their pet projects. Deals they made to get support for the last election, and what they promise to do to get support to win the next election.

To be liberal is to be free thinking; to be conservative is to preserve traditions. This is why the usage of the terms ?liberal? and ?conservative to describe typical Democrats or Republicans is an irritating and most of all ignorant labeling of each. What we really have is a political oligopoly, a two-winged eagle that has a single head. The agendas put forth by both parties over the last few decades has been that of military growth, continued foreign intervention, additional rights (that must be paid by taxpayers somehow), and the monopoly of true political debate.
(COMMENT)

There is no free thinking in Washington. You pay for every thought and it is a party driven thought - right out of the can.

The terms "Liberal" and "Conservative" are just political hate speech. Both parties have proven to be fiscally irresponsible, poorly acquainted with foreign policy, unconcerned about the economy - your job - education and the wasted tax dollars going out to foreign end user to rebuild their infrastructure while ours falls to pieces.

They are the same. They act the just like teams at the little league games we attended as parents. We are for one side, and they the other. It doesn't matter who is right or wrong --- what is best for the nation. It is one side against the other.

Most Respectfully,
R
 
Mar 2009
2,751
6
Undisclosed
Call them whatever you want, they have two ways of thinking about things. I can't say I totally agree with any of them. But I am just right of Dick Cheney.
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Nov 2020
1,571
2
New Amsterdam
Given the existence as uttered forth in the public works of Puncher and Wattmann of a personal God quaquaquaqua with white beard quaquaquaqua outside time without extension who from the heights of divine apathia divine athambia divine aphasia loves us dearly with some exceptions for reasons unknown but time will tell and suffers like the divine Miranda with those who for reasons unknown but time will tell are plunged in torment plunged in fire whose fire flames if that continues and who can doubt it will fire the firmament that is to say blast heaven to hell so blue still and calm so calm with a calm which even though intermittent is better than nothing but not so fast and considering what is more that as a result of the labours left unfinished crowned by the Acacacacademy of Anthropopopometry of Essy-in-Possy of Testew and Cunard it is established beyond all doubt all other doubt than that which clings to the labours of men that as a result of the labours unfinished of Testew and Cunard it is established as hereinafter but not so fast for reasons unknown that as a result of the public works of Puncher and Wattmann it is established beyond all doubt that in view of the labours of Fartov and Belcher left unfinished for reasons unknown of Testew and Cunard left unfinished it is established what many deny that man in Possy of Testew and Cunard that man in Essy that man in short that man in brief in spite of the strides of alimentation and defecation is seen to waste and pine waste and pine and concurrently simultaneously what is more for reasons unknown in spite of the strides of physical culture the practice of sports such as tennis football running cycling swimming flying floating riding gliding conating camogie skating tennis of all kinds dying flying sports of all sorts autumn summer winter winter tennis of all kinds hockey of all sorts penicilline and succedanea in a word I resume and concurrently simultaneously for reasons unknown to shrink and dwindle in spite of the tennis I resume flying gliding golf over nine and eighteen holes tennis of all sorts in a word for reasons unknown in Feckham Peckham Fulham Clapham namely concurrently simultaneously what is more for reasons unknown but time will tell to shrink and dwindle I resume Fulham Clapham in a word the dead loss per head since the death of Bishop Berkeley being to the tune of one inch four ounce per head approximately by and large more or less to the nearest decimal good measure round figures stark naked in the stockinged feet in Connemara in a word for reasons unknown no matter what matter the facts are there and considering what is more much more grave that in the light of the labours lost of Steinweg and Peterman it appears what is more much more grave that in the light the light the light of the labours lost of Steinweg and Peterman that in the plains in the mountains by the seas by the rivers running water running fire the air is the same and than the earth namely the air and then the earth in the great cold the great dark the air and the earth abode of stones in the great cold alas alas in the year of their Lord six hundred and something the air the earth the sea the earth abode of stones in the great deeps the great cold on sea on land and in the air I resume for reasons unknown in spite of the tennis the facts are there but time will tell I resume alas alas on on in short in fine on on abode of stones who can doubt it I resume but not so fast I resume the skull to shrink and waste and concurrently simultaneously what is more for reasons unknown in spite of the tennis on on the beard the flames the tears the stones so blue so calm alas alas on on the skull the skull the skull the skull in Connemara in spite of the tennis the labours abandoned left unfinished graver still abode of stones in a word I resume alas alas abandoned unfinished the skull the skull in Connemara in spite of the tennis the skull alas the stones Cunard (mêlée, final vociferations) tennis… the stones… so calm… Cunard… unfinished…” vGiven the existence as uttered forth in the public works of Puncher and Wattmann of a personal God quaquaquaqua with white beard quaquaquaqua outside time without extension who from the heights of divine apathia divine athambia divine aphasia loves us dearly with some exceptions for reasons unknown but time will tell and suffers like the divine Miranda with those who for reasons unknown but time will tell are plunged in torment plunged in fire whose fire flames if that continues and who can doubt it will fire the firmament that is to say blast heaven to hell so blue still and calm so calm with a calm which even though intermittent is better than nothing but not so fast and considering what is more that as a result of the labours left unfinished crowned by the Acacacacademy of Anthropopopometry of Essy-in-Possy of Testew and Cunard it is established beyond all doubt all other doubt than that which clings to the labours of men that as a result of the labours unfinished of Testew and Cunard it is established as hereinafter but not so fast for reasons unknown that as a result of the public works of Puncher and Wattmann it is established beyond all doubt that in view of the labours of Fartov and Belcher left unfinished for reasons unknown of Testew and Cunard left unfinished it is established what many deny that man in Possy of Testew and Cunard that man in Essy that man in short that man in brief in spite of the strides of alimentation and defecation is seen to waste and pine waste and pine and concurrently simultaneously what is more for reasons unknown in spite of the strides of physical culture the practice of sports such as tennis football running cycling swimming flying floating riding gliding conating camogie skating tennis of all kinds dying flying sports of all sorts autumn summer winter winter tennis of all kinds hockey of all sorts penicilline and succedanea in a word I resume and concurrently simultaneously for reasons unknown to shrink and dwindle in spite of the tennis I resume flying gliding golf over nine and eighteen holes tennis of all sorts in a word for reasons unknown in Feckham Peckham Fulham Clapham namely concurrently simultaneously what is more for reasons unknown but time will tell to shrink and dwindle I resume Fulham Clapham in a word the dead loss per head since the death of Bishop Berkeley being to the tune of one inch four ounce per head approximately by and large more or less to the nearest decimal good measure round figures stark naked in the stockinged feet in Connemara in a word for reasons unknown no matter what matter the facts are there and considering what is more much more grave that in the light of the labours lost of Steinweg and Peterman it appears what is more much more grave that in the light the light the light of the labours lost of Steinweg and Peterman that in the plains in the mountains by the seas by the rivers running water running fire the air is the same and than the earth namely the air and then the earth in the great cold the great dark the air and the earth abode of stones in the great cold alas alas in the year of their Lord six hundred and something the air the earth the sea the earth abode of stones in the great deeps the great cold on sea on land and in the air I resume for reasons unknown in spite of the tennis the facts are there but time will tell I resume alas alas on on in short in fine on on abode of stones who can doubt it I resume but not so fast I resume the skull to shrink and waste and concurrently simultaneously what is more for reasons unknown in spite of the tennis on on the beard the flames the tears the stones so blue so calm alas alas on on the skull the skull the skull the skull in Connemara in spite of the tennis the labours abandoned left unfinished graver still abode of stones in a word I resume alas alas abandoned unfinished the skull the skull in Connemara in spite of the tennis the skull alas the stones Cunard (mêlée, final vociferations) tennis… the stones… so calm… Cunard… unfinished…”
 
Nov 2020
1,571
2
New Amsterdam
Given the existence as uttered forth in the public works of Puncher and Wattmann of a personal God quaquaquaqua with white beard quaquaquaqua outside time without extension who from the heights of divine apathia divine athambia divine aphasia loves us dearly with some exceptions for reasons unknown but time will tell and suffers like the divine Miranda with those who for reasons unknown but time will tell are plunged in torment plunged in fire whose fire flames if that continues and who can doubt it will fire the firmament that is to say blast heaven to hell so blue still and calm so calm with a calm which even though intermittent is better than nothing but not so fast and considering what is more that as a result of the labours left unfinished crowned by the Acacacacademy of Anthropopopometry of Essy-in-Possy of Testew and Cunard it is established beyond all doubt all other doubt than that which clings to the labours of men that as a result of the labours unfinished of Testew and Cunard it is established as hereinafter but not so fast for reasons unknown that as a result of the public works of Puncher and Wattmann it is established beyond all doubt that in view of the labours of Fartov and Belcher left unfinished for reasons unknown of Testew and Cunard left unfinished it is established what many deny that man in Possy of Testew and Cunard that man in Essy that man in short that man in brief in spite of the strides of alimentation and defecation is seen to waste and pine waste and pine and concurrently simultaneously what is more for reasons unknown in spite of the strides of physical culture the practice of sports such as tennis football running cycling swimming flying floating riding gliding conating camogie skating tennis of all kinds dying flying sports of all sorts autumn summer winter winter tennis of all kinds hockey of all sorts penicilline and succedanea in a word I resume and concurrently simultaneously for reasons unknown to shrink and dwindle in spite of the tennis I resume flying gliding golf over nine and eighteen holes tennis of all sorts in a word for reasons unknown in Feckham Peckham Fulham Clapham namely concurrently simultaneously what is more for reasons unknown but time will tell to shrink and dwindle I resume Fulham Clapham in a word the dead loss per head since the death of Bishop Berkeley being to the tune of one inch four ounce per head approximately by and large more or less to the nearest decimal good measure round figures stark naked in the stockinged feet in Connemara in a word for reasons unknown no matter what matter the facts are there and considering what is more much more grave that in the light of the labours lost of Steinweg and Peterman it appears what is more much more grave that in the light the light the light of the labours lost of Steinweg and Peterman that in the plains in the mountains by the seas by the rivers running water running fire the air is the same and than the earth namely the air and then the earth in the great cold the great dark the air and the earth abode of stones in the great cold alas alas in the year of their Lord six hundred and something the air the earth the sea the earth abode of stones in the great deeps the great cold on sea on land and in the air I resume for reasons unknown in spite of the tennis the facts are there but time will tell I resume alas alas on on in short in fine on on abode of stones who can doubt it I resume but not so fast I resume the skull to shrink and waste and concurrently simultaneously what is more for reasons unknown in spite of the tennis on on the beard the flames the tears the stones so blue so calm alas alas on on the skull the skull the skull the skull in Connemara in spite of the tennis the labours abandoned left unfinished graver still abode of stones in a word I resume alas alas abandoned unfinished the skull the skull in Connemara in spite of the tennis the skull alas the stones Cunard (mêlée, final vociferations) tennis… the stones… so calm… Cunard… unfinished…” vGiven the existence as uttered forth in the public works of Puncher and Wattmann of a personal God quaquaquaqua with white beard quaquaquaqua outside time without extension who from the heights of divine apathia divine athambia divine aphasia loves us dearly with some exceptions for reasons unknown but time will tell and suffers like the divine Miranda with those who for reasons unknown but time will tell are plunged in torment plunged in fire whose fire flames if that continues and who can doubt it will fire the firmament that is to say blast heaven to hell so blue still and calm so calm with a calm which even though intermittent is better than nothing but not so fast and considering what is more that as a result of the labours left unfinished crowned by the Acacacacademy of Anthropopopometry of Essy-in-Possy of Testew and Cunard it is established beyond all doubt all other doubt than that which clings to the labours of men that as a result of the labours unfinished of Testew and Cunard it is established as hereinafter but not so fast for reasons unknown that as a result of the public works of Puncher and Wattmann it is established beyond all doubt that in view of the labours of Fartov and Belcher left unfinished for reasons unknown of Testew and Cunard left unfinished it is established what many deny that man in Possy of Testew and Cunard that man in Essy that man in short that man in brief in spite of the strides of alimentation and defecation is seen to waste and pine waste and pine and concurrently simultaneously what is more for reasons unknown in spite of the strides of physical culture the practice of sports such as tennis football running cycling swimming flying floating riding gliding conating camogie skating tennis of all kinds dying flying sports of all sorts autumn summer winter winter tennis of all kinds hockey of all sorts penicilline and succedanea in a word I resume and concurrently simultaneously for reasons unknown to shrink and dwindle in spite of the tennis I resume flying gliding golf over nine and eighteen holes tennis of all sorts in a word for reasons unknown in Feckham Peckham Fulham Clapham namely concurrently simultaneously what is more for reasons unknown but time will tell to shrink and dwindle I resume Fulham Clapham in a word the dead loss per head since the death of Bishop Berkeley being to the tune of one inch four ounce per head approximately by and large more or less to the nearest decimal good measure round figures stark naked in the stockinged feet in Connemara in a word for reasons unknown no matter what matter the facts are there and considering what is more much more grave that in the light of the labours lost of Steinweg and Peterman it appears what is more much more grave that in the light the light the light of the labours lost of Steinweg and Peterman that in the plains in the mountains by the seas by the rivers running water running fire the air is the same and than the earth namely the air and then the earth in the great cold the great dark the air and the earth abode of stones in the great cold alas alas in the year of their Lord six hundred and something the air the earth the sea the earth abode of stones in the great deeps the great cold on sea on land and in the air I resume for reasons unknown in spite of the tennis the facts are there but time will tell I resume alas alas on on in short in fine on on abode of stones who can doubt it I resume but not so fast I resume the skull to shrink and waste and concurrently simultaneously what is more for reasons unknown in spite of the tennis on on the beard the flames the tears the stones so blue so calm alas alas on on the skull the skull the skull the skull in Connemara in spite of the tennis the labours abandoned left unfinished graver still abode of stones in a word I resume alas alas abandoned unfinished the skull the skull in Connemara in spite of the tennis the skull alas the stones Cunard (mêlée, final vociferations) tennis… the stones… so calm… Cunard… unfinished…”
 
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