Hottest on Record

myp

Jan 2009
5,841
50
So its ok for you to reject that the idea of man-made climate change could be debatable. Right.
This is the point that we should agree to disagree because we cannot see each others viewpoint....agreed?

It isn't debatable. To suggest that that atmospheric composition would be the same whether or not we burned fossil fuels (or at any margin- more or less) is an outright lie. You think that the acid rain problems 30 years ago or the smog in China or the hazy skies in cities vs. the countryside are all just random correlations? How can you say that? Even taking it on a micro scale- think of your garage. If you burn a fire in that garage (versus not burning it), is the gaseous content within that garage not going to change?
 
Jul 2009
5,893
474
Port St. Lucie
Yeah it is, prove without a doubt that man has caused the temp to increase.

Greenhouse gasses create a greenhouse effect. Humans produce greenhouse gasses. It's cause and effect, the only thing up for debate is the seriousness of the effect.
 
Oct 2012
4,429
1,084
Louisville, Ky
Yeah it is, prove without a doubt that man has caused the temp to increase.

Direct observations find that CO2 is rising sharply due to human activity. Satellite and surface measurements find less energy is escaping to space at CO2 absorption wavelengths. Ocean and surface temperature measurements find the planet continues to accumulate heat. This gives a line of empirical evidence that human CO2 emissions are causing some level of global warming.
 
Feb 2013
1,219
174
just past the moons of Jupiter
Direct observations find that CO2 is rising sharply due to human activity. Satellite and surface measurements find less energy is escaping to space at CO2 absorption wavelengths. Ocean and surface temperature measurements find the planet continues to accumulate heat. This gives a line of empirical evidence that human CO2 emissions are causing some level of global warming.

Yeah, but how much is being caused by co2 emissions?

You said some level, what if that level is 2%, I don't buy that it is the majority, or even a significant amount, mainly, lack of proof.
 
Oct 2012
4,429
1,084
Louisville, Ky
Yeah, but how much is being caused by co2 emissions?

You said some level, what if that level is 2%, I don't buy that it is the majority, or even a significant amount, mainly, lack of proof.

Am I expected to place the ball between each goalpost after you have moved it?

Until you accept my score on with the first kick:
Yeah it is, prove without a doubt that man has caused the temp to increase.

I see no point in trying to meet your new one.
 
Feb 2013
1,219
174
just past the moons of Jupiter
Am I expected to place the ball between each goalpost after you have moved it?

Until you accept my score on with the first kick:


I see no point in trying to meet your new one.

You have only stated that it is possible. There is no goal posts, just the mere suggestion of a field.

Your agreement is a weak one and your "evidence" isn't.
 
Oct 2012
4,429
1,084
Louisville, Ky
You have only stated that it is possible. There is no goal posts, just the mere suggestion of a field.

Your agreement is a weak one and your "evidence" isn't.

Actually, you asked for proof humans had increased the temperature on Earth...I handily provided it. You then almost agreed with what was provided, but decided to instead temper the acceptance with a new question....we call this moving the goalpost in debate.
I simply wish for you to admit the first goal was met before I spend the time meeting the next one.

Are you somewhat new to this?
 
Feb 2013
1,219
174
just past the moons of Jupiter
Actually, you asked for proof humans had increased the temperature on Earth...I handily provided it. You then almost agreed with what was provided, but decided to instead temper the acceptance with a new question....we call this moving the goalpost in debate.
I simply wish for you to admit the first goal was met before I spend the time meeting the next one.
you provided no proof, only a suggestion. that isn't a goal post, it isn't even a field.
 
Oct 2012
4,429
1,084
Louisville, Ky
you provided no proof, only a suggestion. that isn't a goal post, it isn't even a field.

As it is obvious you are incapable of understanding the simple logic and basic ideas involved in science...as well as somewhat limited where debate concept is involved I will give you the win to avoid wasting my time.
 
Feb 2013
1,219
174
just past the moons of Jupiter
As it is obvious you are incapable of understanding the simple logic and basic ideas involved in science...as well as somewhat limited where debate concept is involved I will give you the win to avoid wasting my time.

nice, and you are the moderator?

Science that suggests, doesn't conclude. It is obvious who understands.

and crying because you can't hit a moving target, okay.
 
Last edited:
Oct 2012
4,429
1,084
Louisville, Ky
nice, and you are the moderator?

Yes...and you will note I was polite and accurate, did not try to debase you, insult you, or do anything other than dismiss you.

Being a Mod teaches one the lines to walk up to.....as well as the individuals to avoid.

Enjoy the Forum.
 
Feb 2013
1,219
174
just past the moons of Jupiter
Yes...and you will note I was polite and accurate, did not try to debase you, insult you, or do anything other than dismiss you.

Being a Mod teaches one the lines to walk up to.....as well as the individuals to avoid.

Enjoy the Forum.

Avoid everybody that disagrees with you, good strategy, just give up. Nice
 
Feb 2012
536
6
England
This is one of those subjects that seems to upset people to a large degree.
It really is best to just go seperate ways in what we believe as true or likely.
 
Feb 2013
1,219
174
just past the moons of Jupiter
This is one of those subjects that seems to upset people to a large degree.
It really is best to just go seperate ways in what we believe as true or likely.

Well, I believe the jury is still out, there isn't enough support either way, no need to panic about it
 
Jul 2009
5,893
474
Port St. Lucie
Well, I believe the jury is still out, there isn't enough support either way, no need to panic about it

Ya, massive global crop failures and major cities being all but wiped out by super storms that once only occurred every 300 or so years as the polar ice caps melt and mess up the ocean/air currents and biosphere isn't anything to panic about. You do realize we're in the middle of a mass extinction event (Holocene), right?
 
Feb 2013
1,219
174
just past the moons of Jupiter
Ya, massive global crop failures and major cities being all but wiped out by super storms that once only occurred every 300 or so years as the polar ice caps melt and mess up the ocean/air currents and biosphere isn't anything to panic about. You do realize we're in the middle of a mass extinction event (Holocene), right?

panic isn't going to fix it.
 

myp

Jan 2009
5,841
50
This is one of those subjects that seems to upset people to a large degree.
It really is best to just go seperate ways in what we believe as true or likely.

The problem is there is a point at which something is fact and then a point where there is room for speculation and belief. It is upsetting that some people find it okay to reject the facts for their political agenda or whatever other reason. Try lighting a fire in your house and tell me the composition of the air does not change. (don't actually do it- the change in air composition could be detrimental to your health)- I don't understand how anyone can suggest something so absurd.
 
Feb 2012
536
6
England
The problem is there is a point at which something is fact and then a point where there is room for speculation and belief. It is upsetting that some people find it okay to reject the facts for their political agenda or whatever other reason. Try lighting a fire in your house and tell me the composition of the air does not change. (don't actually do it- the change in air composition could be detrimental to your health)- I don't understand how anyone can suggest something so absurd.

I agree entirely with your first sentence.
You and I are not at the same point.

I agree with your second sentence too.
It is upsetting when some people ignore facts that do not fit in with their own opinion...and also when they resort to ridicule/name calling in their frustration.

If you alter your analogy to someone else lighting the fire or a fire that reignites after being dormant for some time then we might have mutual ground.

Lets look at pandemics for a moment.
Every year thousands of people die of 'seasonal' flu right?
Bird flu appeared...the word 'pandemic' was used...people expected to catch it and die on a world wide scale. True?
Swine flu appeared.....the word 'pandemic' was used again, used both times by those apparantly with knowledge of such things. People expected to become ill withing weeks or even days and die from it.
Both instances caused panic but there was not a world wide event of people dying left right and centre was there?
The numbers that die each year from various forms of flu were dismissed as irrelevant.
Now I know you will probably conjure up figures to show huge death rates from Bird/Swine flu and defend the use of vaccines designed to combat both but the FACT remains that wrong or shall we say misleading information was given.
It happens.
 
Oct 2012
4,429
1,084
Louisville, Ky
I agree entirely with your first sentence.
You and I are not at the same point.

I agree with your second sentence too.
It is upsetting when some people ignore facts that do not fit in with their own opinion...and also when they resort to ridicule/name calling in their frustration.

If you alter your analogy to someone else lighting the fire or a fire that reignites after being dormant for some time then we might have mutual ground.

Lets look at pandemics for a moment.
Every year thousands of people die of 'seasonal' flu right?
Bird flu appeared...the word 'pandemic' was used...people expected to catch it and die on a world wide scale. True?
Swine flu appeared.....the word 'pandemic' was used again, used both times by those apparantly with knowledge of such things. People expected to become ill withing weeks or even days and die from it.
Both instances caused panic but there was not a world wide event of people dying left right and centre was there?
The numbers that die each year from various forms of flu were dismissed as irrelevant.
Now I know you will probably conjure up figures to show huge death rates from Bird/Swine flu and defend the use of vaccines designed to combat both but the FACT remains that wrong or shall we say misleading information was given.
It happens.

I see, so rather than take note of and prepare for a pandemic, we should instead ignore the issue until it has run it's course and evaluate the results. In this way we will be absolutely sure how many were infected, died, and became ill before spending the time, treasure, and effort to avert the pandemic we can no longer do anything about.
Though this approach will certainly allow for absolute verification of the extent of the damage, and likely save resources it will make no difference to those who were impacted by the virus...though we may learn enough about it to develop a vaccine.

The problem with this analogy is the possible result of applying it to something capable of effecting virtually every aspect of what we call civilization. Something that does not "Run it's Course" over a few years, cannot be vaccinated against, and awaiting absolute verification would likely mean it is too late to do anything regardless...it may already be anyway.
You may be correct in that this is nothing to worry about, but consider the results if you are not. There is very little chance a mile wide asteroid will impact the Earth in your lifetime, but if it does we are all toast....thus we spend billions looking as a just in case because we know how bad it would be.
We have a very good idea what the impact of higher temperatures will be, and so we worry about this in much the same way....only it seems this has a much larger chance of happening in your lifetime, and is probably happening right now.

A slow poison still kills.
 
Top