Obama's Visit to China - any meaningful developments from it?

deanhills · Nov 17, 2009

What do you think has been achieved by Obama's visit to China? I can't see anything changing, although Obama probably is hoping for some goodwill between the two countries, but it looks like China is passing the United States as the stronger one in terms of economy, especially when it is making major inroads in Africa, which seems to favour China over the United States, because of China's deeper pockets.

myp · Nov 18, 2009

deanhills said:
What do you think has been achieved by Obama's visit to China? I can't see anything changing, although Obama probably is hoping for some goodwill between the two countries, but it looks like China is passing the United States as the stronger one in terms of economy, especially when it is making major inroads in Africa, which seems to favour China over the United States, because of China's deeper pockets.

There hasn't been anything overly significant as you said. The human rights tensions are still there and the Chinese are scarred of us weakening the dollar further. Ironically, Geithner came out today and told China they should strengthen the Yuan- talk about hypocrisy...

DodgeFB · Nov 18, 2009

As usual he is just "grand standing". He thinks the world needs him to educate them on how to run their country. At least that is my opinion. I find his trips embarrassing at times.

Dirk · Nov 18, 2009

myp said:
told China they should strengthen the Yuan

Talk about unrealistic, too!

DodgeFB said:
He thinks the world needs him to educate them on how to run their country. I find his trips embarrassing at times.

Top marks! Brilliant analysis, my friend.

deanhills · Nov 20, 2009

Interesting part during the trip was him meeting up with his half brother Mark Ndesandjo who lives in China. I did not realize that Obama had an abusive father. The brother appears to be an interesting character, including talented at playing the piano, and also a writing book that will be released shortly.

For the rest. I'm not a fan of Obama's but he probably did what he had to do. I just thought he took a deeper "bow" to the Japanese ruler than was probably dignified for a US leader, but then considering the enormous debt the US owes Japan, it probably made sense?

Dirk · Nov 20, 2009

deanhills said:
I just thought he took a deeper "bow" to the Japanese ruler than was probably dignified for a US leader, but then considering the enormous debt the US owes Japan, it probably made sense?

I don't get why people are making this an issue. Seriously, if you actually care, the chances are you drive a pick-up, watch fox and have flown the confederate flag a least once in your adult life.

Personally, i don't even think it comment-worthy and am perhaps slightly more interested in what volume of excrement, on average, a fly sits on in a 24-hour period.

I should hazard to say that it is perhaps of greater relevance what was actually said in the meeting than what angle he stooped when adhering to a Japanese custom, merely denoting respect.

DodgeFB · Nov 21, 2009

Seriously, if you actually care, the chances are you drive a pick-up, watch fox and have flown the confederate flag a least once in your adult life.

I have done all three and do two of them almost daily. For several years now I have flown "Old Glory" night and day in front of my home. It even has it's own lighting at night.

As for the Confederate Flag, That flag does not mean to many Southerner's what all the haters think and claim. Some of us had family that died on both sides of that fight. And it takes someone from the South to understand all that goes with that flag. Not just that knee jerk reaction it gets from other places around the world. But it stands on it's own and it is not my place to defend it.

I own a pickup truck and I drive it. I have a car but don't really care for cars. I watch Fox News because they show a side of things that NBC, ABC and CBS refuse to show. Those three are as far left as Fox is far right. If I only watch the ones I agree with I will never learn anything.

myp · Nov 21, 2009

Dirk said:
I don't get why people are making this an issue. Seriously, if you actually care, the chances are you drive a pick-up, watch fox and have flown the confederate flag a least once in your adult life.

Dirk, that really isn't a fair argument because it comes off as an attack and people could be offended by it. We don't want to start a flame war- thankfully, DodgeFB took the intellectual route to addressing that, but others may not be so thoughtful. There really is nothing wrong with doing those three things- they are not illegal and they are the right of any person.

As for the bowing thing, I wouldn't say he did it because of the debt Dean because if you look at visits from past presidents or leaders, even those in debt to Japan, most of them still just shook his hand. Also, if you look at the actual discussions of the talks, Obama was not conceding to Japan at all- in fact, there has been some tension between the two nations as of late due the American military base there in which Japan wants to see a reduction of troops (some calling for us leaving altogether) and we have refused.

Dirk · Nov 21, 2009

myp said:
Dirk, that really isn't a fair argument because it comes off as an attack and people could be offended by it. We don't want to start a flame war- thankfully, DodgeFB took the intellectual route to addressing that, but others may not be so thoughtful.

Well, i apologise if i really offended anyone. That's the last thing i should want to do. I was merely intending to put the fact that i found it unimportant into a humourous perspective.

There really is nothing wrong with doing those three things- they are not illegal and they are the right of any person.

And i was by no means challenging that, of course.

By the way, i have seen all those channels, Dodge, and i can assure you that Fox are right-wing and cnn, msnbc and that are more centre-right. The US doesn't have a left-wing voice at the moment.

DodgeFB · Nov 22, 2009

By the way, i have seen all those channels, Dodge, and i can assure you that Fox are right-wing and cnn, msnbc and that are more centre-right. The US doesn't have a left-wing voice at the moment.

I must disagree there my friend. Even NBC would not want to be called anything right wing. They hate everything right. They just smirk and slobber at times attacking "the right".

myp · Nov 22, 2009

Dirk said:
Well, i apologise if i really offended anyone. That's the last thing i should want to do. I was merely intending to put the fact that i found it unimportant into a humourous perspective.

I figured, but some may not know that you were joking, especially if they are new. I am just trying to keep the peace here

Dirk said:
By the way, i have seen all those channels, Dodge, and i can assure you that Fox are right-wing and cnn, msnbc and that are more centre-right. The US doesn't have a left-wing voice at the moment.

I too will have to disagree with this. I would say CNN is more center-left and MSNBC is definitely left. I admit that Fox is right-winged, but I believe that MSNBC is essentially the equivalent for the left.

Moderate Union · Nov 22, 2009

There was a really good bit on this issue on CNN's Your Money today. All in all, the relationship is a symbiotic relationship. They need each other and both need a return to normalcy. And yes, those latent concerns of the U.S. will always exist as long as there is reason for them to exist.

Dirk · Nov 23, 2009

myp said:
I too will have to disagree with this. I would say CNN is more center-left and MSNBC is definitely left. I admit that Fox is right-winged, but I believe that MSNBC is essentially the equivalent for the left.

Maybe they're just right wing compared to me.

DodgeFB · Nov 24, 2009

Dirk said:
Maybe they're just right wing compared to me.

If you move anymore left and I move anymore right we will bump into each other.

deanhills · Nov 27, 2009

For me the media by nature of what they are are mostly centre left. Perhaps Fox is centre right in the "centre left" sense of the word? Media has always got to investigate and question things, and at the same time entertain. So none of the media can be right in the centre. For me the closest to left in the United States are the Libertarians.

Dirk · Nov 27, 2009

The media could never be left-wing. Ultimately, you need to look at who owns the media and you can determine what interests - and whose interests - they will serve. This whole "the media is too liberal" thing, or whatever, is ridiculous. Because if that's exposed to any modicum of investigation or dissection, you'll find that the opposite is true.

There was a poll of media presenters a while ago (i forget the results). Even if you found that most media presenters voted Democrat, as opposed to Republican, firstly, it doesn't mean much since they're basically just two factions of the same party (they just want to enhance business interests in different ways), and secondly, it's not them who write the scripts. The people who write the scripts are in the direct employ of the owners of the media outlet. Well, you can see who that is, obviously.

What's interesting is that the media matches very similarly the structures of the Democrat and Republican political parties. MSNBC, for example, has quite a mix, liberal to conservative views are discussed. Equally, the Democratic party has everything from the centre-right, such as Obama, to some pretty strong liberals. It even has one or two socialists, if i remember correctly. On the other hand, Fox news is practically the propaganda arm of the Republican Party. It's run entirely to neo-conservative interests. The few party members that don't conform to that view, for example Ron Paul, are repeatedly cut off. Interviews are often a complete joke - see Richard Dawkins on the O'Reilly Show.

But then, that's what you can expect from Rupert Murdoch's gang.

DodgeFB · Nov 27, 2009

The media has gone about as far left as they can get in this country. The media and Oprah caused many of our problems. Oprah picked this goofy president we are now stuck with. She can just mention anything or anyone and her "fans" fall in line.

Anymore left in this country and I will be looking for a way to my end. Most of the country I love is gone anyway.

Dirk · Nov 27, 2009

DodgeFB said:
The media has gone about as far left as they can get in this country.The media and Oprah caused many of our problems.

Oprah picked this goofy president we are now stuck with.

If you're attempting to demonstrate that Oprah is left wing, you're kind of contradicting yourself.

DodgeFB · Nov 28, 2009

Dirk said:
If you're attempting to demonstrate that Oprah is left wing, you're kind of contradicting yourself.

I don't think she is any wing. I think she has too much influence on people. And she wanted a black president so she got one. The black president is okay. But they needed someone with common sense not just book sense. I have always heard of an "educated fool" and never understood. I am beginning to get it now.

Dirk · Nov 28, 2009

DodgeFB said:
I don't think she is any wing. I think she has too much influence on people.

Oh, right.

My mistake.

When opinion is manufactured by the media, something's going wrong.

Obama's Visit to China - any meaningful developments from it?

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