Hillary's Testimony Emotional.

[misterveritis]

You said we did nothing. I gave you an example of an attempted rescue. You go, "No u!" I think you lose this debate.

Try again. Obama did nothing.
The military did nothing substantive.
The Abandoned Four were murdered in a terrorist attack. Obama's Benghazi Massacre occurred while he slept. He had to look pretty for his campaign event.

And you still cover for the One, our Dear Leader.

 

[misterveritis]

A CIA team and pro-West militias fighting there way to the consulate isn't doing nothing. Believe it or not but it's possible for our guys to lose a battle.

Yeah. It really is nothing. If it even happened it was too little too late.

I believe it is a fabrication.

 

[misterveritis]

None...yet my ability to read is obviously superior to your ability to attack an argument rather than a person.

It was clear to me that either you had no military experience or you had forgotten much.

Your lack of experience is germane to the issue.

 

[David]

Yeah. It really is nothing. If it even happened it was too little too late.

I believe it is a fabrication.

Too little too late? It was an immediate response and as we didn't have any military forces in the area it was as much as we could muster. Again, we didn't invade Libya, all we had were spies and glorified police.

 

[misterveritis]

Too little too late? It was an immediate response and as we didn't have any military forces in the area it was as much as we could muster. Again, we didn't invade Libya, all we had were spies and glorified police.

We have these things called airplanes. They are a wonder to behold. Although they are very heavy they can fly to far away places very quickly. We have them all over the world. We had them close to the fight. We did not use them. Why not?

The One did not want to get involved, provide leadership, take a stand, be accountable...so he Abandoned the Four to Massacre in Benghazi. Obama's Benghazi Massacre.

And you still cover for him.

 

[David]

We have these things called airplanes. They are a wonder to behold. Although they are very heavy they can fly to far away places very quickly. We have them all over the world. We had them close to the fight. We did not use them. Why not?

The One did not want to get involved, provide leadership, take a stand, be accountable...so he Abandoned the Four to Massacre in Benghazi. Obama's Benghazi Massacre.

And you still cover for him.

And what would you have those plans do? Carpet bomb the consulate? Land people at the airport and end up with them in the same situation as the CIA (only further away)?

 

[misterveritis]

And what would you have those plans do? Carpet bomb the consulate? Land people at the airport and end up with them in the same situation as the CIA (only further away)?

Once in the area there are many options. The first thing simple thing is to fly low and fast. It makes the enemy nervous. That buys time.

Second, if communications with the ground have been established then let the guys on the ground place their calls for fire in the usual way. SEALS know how to do this.

Third, if there are laser designators in the fight then the guys on the ground can lase where they want the ordnance to go.

We could have kept aircraft over the battlefield as long as necessary. And troops in numbers should have been dispatched as well.

 

[misterveritis]

And what would you have those plans do? Carpet bomb the consulate? Land people at the airport and end up with them in the same situation as the CIA (only further away)?

We could have done several things at the same time. A reinforced company landing at the airport could have fought its way to the consulate. If the Libyans object let them make their case after the battle is over. They had the responsibility for defending the Consulate and they failed.

We could have dropped in the first reinforcing troops. One response team would have made all the difference. A platoon would have turned the battle in our favor.

 

[David]

We could have done several things at the same time. A reinforced company landing at the airport could have fought its way to the consulate. If the Libyans object let them make their case after the battle is over. They had the responsibility for defending the Consulate and they failed.

We could have dropped in the first reinforcing troops. One response team would have made all the difference. A platoon would have turned the battle in our favor.

You already had a CIA team fighting it's way to the consulate. They were only 2 blocks away, another team coming from the airport would have only resulted in a dead SpecOps team (think Black Hawk down if you doubt this). As for landing troops directly, where? Helicopters would of been too slow and a cityscape isn't much of a runway (particularly when bullets and missiles would be greeting the planes). Really, without already having an armored division in the area, all that could be done without killing civilians and allied militiamen was done. If you want to argue that the consulate's security detail was too small fine but your current argument is ignoring logistical reality to score political points.

 

[misterveritis]

You already had a CIA team fighting it's way to the consulate. They were only 2 blocks away, another team coming from the airport would have only resulted in a dead SpecOps team (think Black Hawk down if you doubt this). As for landing troops directly, where? Helicopters would of been too slow and a cityscape isn't much of a runway (particularly when bullets and missiles would be greeting the planes). Really, without already having an armored division in the area, all that could be done without killing civilians and allied militiamen was done. If you want to argue that the consulate's security detail was too small fine but your current argument is ignoring logistical reality to score political points.

Have you served many years? Which branch?

We have lots of ways to do forced entry. We can jump from airplanes (I mentioned them before, remember?). We can land at airports and fight our way to where we are needed. We can go over the shore. We can come in by helicopter.

You don't have to be born there.

I think a mix of methods was the right approach. Put a response team in the air, load up reinforcements to land at the airport. Develop the situation through a response.

But the president checked out of the net. It was only four dead Americans. No biggie. The King was untouched. That is all that really matters. Obama's Benghazi Massacre will be forgotten just as the Abandoned Four have been.

 

[David]

Have you served many years? Which branch?

We have lots of ways to do forced entry. We can jump from airplanes (I mentioned them before, remember?). We can land at airports and fight our way to where we are needed. We can go over the shore. We can come in by helicopter.

You don't have to be born there.

I think a mix of methods was the right approach. Put a response team in the air, load up reinforcements to land at the airport. Develop the situation through a response.

But the president checked out of the net. It was only four dead Americans. No biggie. The King was untouched. That is all that really matters. Obama's Benghazi Massacre will be forgotten just as the Abandoned Four have been.

Again, helicopters would of been to slow, the airport would of been too slow and potentially suicidal and paratroopers into a gun trotting horde slowly descending with a large conspicuous object overhead, what could go wrong? Are you following your arguments to their logical conclusions or just throwing stuff out to see what sticks?

 

[tecoyah]

Again, helicopters would of been to slow, the airport would of been too slow and potentially suicidal and paratroopers into a gun trotting horde slowly descending with a large conspicuous object overhead, what could go wrong? Are you following your arguments to their logical conclusions or just throwing stuff out to see what sticks?

One if the most intersting tactics in debate is extrapolation. Watching the way in which in one opines when adding to fact can open a window into the mindset.

 

[misterveritis]

Again, helicopters would of been to slow, the airport would of been too slow and potentially suicidal and paratroopers into a gun trotting horde slowly descending with a large conspicuous object overhead, what could go wrong? Are you following your arguments to their logical conclusions or just throwing stuff out to see what sticks?

The US military has a great deal of experience in combining arms to accomplish missions. This one was not much different than any other hard task.

The consulate grounds were big enough to drop a team or a squad onto. If that was not sufficient then find the nearest place that is big enough.

Was the airport too small for C-17s? Two or three of those could have brought in troops and vehicles. It could have brought in controllers to set up an airhead.

We had lots of unused options. Why? Why did the One abandon four Americans to be murdered? He spent all of fifteen minutes before, as Pontius Pilate, washed his hands and disappeared for eight hours. Let their blood be upon Panetta's head.

 

[Stonewall]

One if the most intersting tactics in debate is extrapolation. Watching the way in which in one opines when adding to fact can open a window into the mindset.

Speaking of opening a window into a mindset.

Obama blames the video in his UN speech - YouTube

This is a September 29 speech to the UN.

I'm of a mindset that our President is a constant and consistent national embarrassment. To blame this entire sad event on a f'n video....weeks after it occurred in other words long after everyone knows this isn't any f'n movie protest gone violent....looks like we are a tent full of circus clowns, our top hat wearing ringleader in front of the world.....acting like a total moron.:help:

For the love of God.

 

[tecoyah]

Speaking of opening a window into a mindset.

Obama blames the video in his UN speech - YouTube

This is a September 29 speech to the UN.

I'm of a mindset that our President is a constant and consistent national embarrassment. To blame this entire sad event on a f'n video....weeks after it occurred in other words long after everyone knows this isn't any f'n movie protest gone violent....looks like we are a tent full of circus clowns, our top hat wearing ringleader in front of the world.....acting like a total moron.:help:

For the love of God.

I assume you failed to actually watch the video you provided (Let alone the actual speech) , or for some reason you are incapable of understanding the spoken word in context.
The clip you placed here has absolutely nothing to do with Benghazi, as the President was addressing the video that sparked protests throughout the region in the context of the first amendment of our constitution...remember that?

There are many avenues you can attempt to debase your president without making things up, pretending you know more than you obviously do, or generally coming off as an angry little man who Tevos fox news in order to figure out what you believe today.

Obama has screwed up far too many things worth ranting about...why do we need to make things up?

 

[Brooks]

a. While your story about a single handed effort of a navy seal holding down the fort (so to speak) has the stench of the right-wing propaganda network (faux, et al) and Mitt Romney using that same canard himself ( Mother of Slain Navy Seal At Benghazi Tells Romney To Stop Using Her Son | Crooks and Liars )

b.the point is the incident was unfortunate and I have read no unbiased proof that the culpability worked its way up to the Secretary Of State.

c. I do not trust our government nor the corporate controlled media, regardless of ideology.

d. Just as I am sure that the Obama administration would lie about it,
so too would the GOP machine and its thralls.

a. What has Fox News, et al to do with any of this? I think there's this feeling on many political fora that the mere mention of the F word proves something about the post to which one is responding.

b. She is ultimately responsible, obviously, but to believe her culpability is only indirect is to suspend quite a bit of disbelief. We aleady know that President Obama knew what was going on (as per Panetta's own testimony). Mrs. Clinton's subordinates also knew.
Do you believe that the information stream bypassed her?
NO Secretary of State, and she claims to be particularly hands-on, would tolerate being left out of such an important loop. Her people's SOP would absolutely include her being kept apprised of anything this important.

c. But you seem to put a lot of trust in Mrs. Clinton's denial.
On a side note: the flower bulb industry, green technologies, bicycle manufacturing plants, the oil industry, computer manufacturers, Wendy's, etc... are all examples of entities that are corporate controlled.
I don't understand the relevance of only prefixing the phrase "corporate controlled" to "media".

d. That's kind of a convenient way to let this slide, don't you think?
I'm relatively new here but I'm sure there are some fine threads about GOP lies where they can be discussed.
Those GOP lies don't mitigate the administration's panic freeze during Benghazi.

 

[misterveritis]

The Obama Sock Puppet

I assume you failed to actually watch the video you provided (Let alone the actual speech) , or for some reason you are incapable of understanding the spoken word in context.
The clip you placed here has absolutely nothing to do with Benghazi, as the President was addressing the video that sparked protests throughout the region in the context of the first amendment of our constitution...remember that?

There are many avenues you can attempt to debase your president without making things up, pretending you know more than you obviously do, or generally coming off as an angry little man who Tevos fox news in order to figure out what you believe today.

Obama has screwed up far too many things worth ranting about...why do we need to make things up?

I think we have discovered our very first Obama sock puppet.

 

[Stonewall]

I assume you failed to actually watch the video you provided (Let alone the actual speech) , or for some reason you are incapable of understanding the spoken word in context.
The clip you placed here has absolutely nothing to do with Benghazi, as the President was addressing the video that sparked protests throughout the region in the context of the first amendment of our constitution...remember that?

The video that "sparked protests throughout the region" tecoyah? This is exactly what I'm speaking to, I'd like to use your first paragraph here as exhibit A. Not only did I listen to this joke of a speech, tecoyah..I listened to Susan Rice and Hillary Clinton talk about this 'movie protest' and the United States having "nothing to do with it" as the President mimics in this UN speech. I also listened to Hillary Clinton's testimony to Congress concerning the REAL explanation and reason for this attack, the rising presence of militant Islam and al-Qaeda in Egypt and Libya and the entire African continent that opposes US presence and influence. And it's become a serious issue since the fall of lonstanding regimes in Egypt and Libya...that we had a both direct and indirect hands and feet in removing. That is what is sparking violence against us, it isn't some B rated movie. These protests and attacks come on the anniversary of 9-11, wake up, America. And especially you, Mr. joke of a President.

There are many avenues you can attempt to debase your president without making things up, pretending you know more than you obviously do, or generally coming off as an angry little man who Tevos fox news in order to figure out what you believe today.

He made the movie protest up tecoyah...and so you did too. you mention it above as a distraction, it isn't the reason we're hated, the reality in the ME much different. And much to blame as far as this incompetent circus clown is concerned. It isn't about a movie,

Obama has screwed up far too many things worth ranting about...why do we need to make things up?

He totally screwed this up. The British had already left being attacked during the summer. The signs were everywhere ambassador Stevens himself making stern note of it.....and it was ignored. Some movie protest gone awry is what the President speaks to at the UN...he doesn't fool anyone save for his most ardent supporters, you seem to be one of them. Shameful!

 

[tecoyah]

....snip....

He totally screwed this up. The British had already left being attacked during the summer. The signs were everywhere ambassador Stevens himself making stern note of it.....and it was ignored. Some movie protest gone awry is what the President speaks to at the UN...he doesn't fool anyone save for his most ardent supporters,you seem to be one of them. Shameful!

This to me is a large part of the failure in communication we find in this country. By pointing out the obvious error you have made in a comment...I have become a shameful supporter of something you obviously do not like, and am thus placed in some arbitrary box of the bad.
I would point out my political leaning, (which is certainly not as simple as you choose to paint it), but experience tells me the effort to defend my positions would be entirely wasted and really makes little difference regardless, as the mindset portrayed pushes your opinions into irrelevance.

This debate site is intended to avoid the typical ignorant bias found in hundreds of others, if possible, I ask that you help us reach that goal.

 

[Stonewall]

Experience tells me also any attempt would be wasted to defend this President or his lack of action here. Furthermore, ignorant bias is trying to deflect to some movie protest, you must be kidding me.

And who is "us?"

Don't wish to reply, don't. Wish to defend this curcus clown, do so. But Im gonna paint that fence when it deserves it. Your deflections here certainly deserve no less. Many apologies.