Budget Cuts ? UNACCEPTABLE ANSWER

Protectionist · Jan 10, 2013

chris7375 said:
Actually no I won't because we would not qualify for it anyway. I maybe out of work though I was not stupid. I lost my job to an accident that almost paralyzed me. I had accident insurance so I still get paid.

Yes I have done quite a bit of research. How about you? Answer me this if Government should run it why such a high overhead? Why is it only 20 cents on every dollar makes it to the public? Why is a charity's overhead so much less then the government? Oh I can go into all the research I have on this subject if you so want me too.

There is a down turn to Obama care he failed to implement it correctly. You go all in on Universal Healthcare or you don't. Obama went sort of kinda into Universal Healthcare. Not only did he do that but he passed the cost on to the healthcare companies which in turn raise the rates of those who have healthcare. The other downfall is employer like my wife's former employer is force to provide insurance for their workers if they are full time. So what do they do cut people to part time to solve the problem. Then Obama tell the people if you so choose not to have healthcare coverage you will be penalized for it. Hey that sort of sounds close to a Socialist type Government to me.

That is the problem with dependency programs and that mentality. I paid into also and still do and I am not for those programs.

Since you like to talk down to me I will do the same. Maybe you should take your memory meds I have stated to you before I am for Social Security for the retired. I am for Medicare for the retired. I am more app to go along with Food Stamps and some welfare if it was used only for the retired older Americans. Though as a whole I am no for this:

[YOUTUBE]rPRtIOmPOD0[/YOUTUBE]

Why should I have to pay to feed her fifteen kids. She is quite capable of working yet she don't. So the system has quite a bit of failure where charities excel. A charity would work to get this woman working and less dependent. The government does nothing to get you working and allows people like this to stay dependent.

1. Actually, YES, you may NEED that welfare some day. It is IMPOSSIBLE for anyone to say they will never need welfare.

2. I just told you I've DONE the research by BEING the person involved RECEIVING the food assistance. THAT IS the research, and the ONLY true, valid RESEARCH. Since you said you have not gotten welfare, then NO, you Have NOT done the research.

3. Socialist govt ? So what ? What;s wrong with that ? OUR govt is socialist in part (and YOU MAY NEED that socialism some day) And if your wife has a pre-existing condition then you need it right now.

4. You are not for those programs, UNTIL YOU NEED THEM. THEN you'll be for them.

5. I agree with you on the 15 kids thing. Some women need to be sterilized. TIE THE TUBES.

chris7375 · Jan 10, 2013

Protectionist said:
1. Actually, YES, you may NEED that welfare some day. It is IMPOSSIBLE for anyone to say they will never need welfare.

Actually I have a choice. If I so need assistance one day I can choose to go to charities for assistance rather then the Government. SO no I don't have to use the Government assistance. Church's offer programs so really I may never have to use it at least while I am young.

Protectionist said:
2. I just told you I've DONE the research by BEING the person involved RECEIVING the food assistance. THAT IS the research, and the ONLY true, valid RESEARCH. Since you said you have not gotten welfare, then NO, you Have NOT done the research.

No using the system is far from research. This is why you hold no credibility in my eyes. Research is looking into the programs cost, effectiveness so on and so forth. Research is far from using the program itself. Though who am I to argue you know all.

Protectionist said:
3. Socialist govt ? So what ? What;s wrong with that ? OUR govt is socialist in part (and YOU MAY NEED that socialism some day) And if your wife has a pre-existing condition then you need it right now.

So you are for having our freedoms stripped away. I am glad I know this. You are for keeping guns correct. You do realize in a socialist Government that right gets taken away. This is why you have no clue how the world really works. You said you taught Economics in College correct yet you don't know that every dictionary say your name is an Economic theory. The what do you do bash those who point it out to them and tell them they are wrong. When you learn to research your subject come back at me with something.

Protectionist said:
4. You are not for those programs, UNTIL YOU NEED THEM. THEN you'll be for them.

Actually people such as myself are quite capable of choosing not to use the programs and find other means to help. It takes research which apparently you have clue one how to do.

Protectionist said:
5. I agree with you on the 15 kids thing. Some women need to be sterilized. TIE THE TUBES.

This is the only thing we agree on.

tecoyah · Jan 10, 2013

Personally, I see experience as a very powerful form of research...and in fact value it above many others. Most books are based on experience and study, most of the sciences are based mostly on experience.

Experience with a thing, seems the purest form of knowing...though it is subject to individual perception like everything else.

chris7375 · Jan 10, 2013

tecoyah said:
Personally, I see experience as a very powerful form of research...and in fact value it above many others. Most books are based on experience and study, most of the sciences are based mostly on experience.

Experience with a thing, seems the purest form of knowing...though it is subject to individual perception like everything else.

Experience is one thing using a system is another thing. To get food stamps you fill out paper work and wait for approval. You either get it or you don't. If you do you collect a certain amount of money to spend on food per month.

This hardly qualifies as experience in saying whether the system is right or wrong.

tecoyah · Jan 10, 2013

chris7375 said:
Experience is one thing using a system is another thing. To get food stamps you fill out paper work and wait for approval. You either get it or you don't. If you do you collect a certain amount of money to spend on food per month.

This hardly qualifies as experience in saying whether the system is right or wrong.

It entails far more experience than I have experienced....thus it's value to me.

chris7375 · Jan 10, 2013

tecoyah said:
It entails far more experience than I have experienced....thus it's value to me.

The funny thing is he assumes I have never used the system.

Many years ago I was on it though that was 12 years ago.

I have experience using the system. I was all for the system until I started looking deeper into the system. My views changed because I saw the Government can't run programs like that effectively.

Though I have experience I did outside research to come to my conclusion.

tecoyah · Jan 10, 2013

chris7375 said:
The funny thing is he assumes I have never used the system.

Many years ago I was on it though that was 12 years ago.

I have experience using the system. I was all for the system until I started looking deeper into the system. My views changed because I saw the Government can't run programs like that effectively.

Though I have experience I did outside research to come to my conclusion.

Good to know, your position has gained validity. My point being that the experience is a part of it, and to dismiss it is seems akin to using blinders.
I value the opinions of a Marine when it comes to war, above that of an economist, though both have valuable input.

chris7375 · Jan 10, 2013

tecoyah said:
Good to know, your position has gained validity. My point being that the experience is a part of it, and to dismiss it is seems akin to using blinders.
I value the opinions of a Marine when it comes to war, above that of an economist, though both have valuable input.

Point taken. You are correct.

Protectionist · Jan 10, 2013

chris7375 said:
Actually I have a choice. If I so need assistance one day I can choose to go to charities for assistance rather then the Government. SO no I don't have to use the Government assistance. Church's offer programs so really I may never have to use it at least while I am young.

No using the system is far from research. This is why you hold no credibility in my eyes. Research is looking into the programs cost, effectiveness so on and so forth. Research is far from using the program itself. Though who am I to argue you know all.

So you are for having our freedoms stripped away. I am glad I know this. You are for keeping guns correct. You do realize in a socialist Government that right gets taken away. This is why you have no clue how the world really works. You said you taught Economics in College correct yet you don't know that every dictionary say your name is an Economic theory. The what do you do bash those who point it out to them and tell them they are wrong. When you learn to research your subject come back at me with something.

Actually people such as myself are quite capable of choosing not to use the programs and find other means to help. It takes research which apparently you have clue one how to do.

This is the only thing we agree on.

1. Unlike you, I have BEEN THERE. I've been poor enough to need assistancfe (and still am now). And I can tell FROM EXPERIENCE, the Church's do help but it's nowhere near enough. Without my food stamp benefit, I'd be starving right now. I know what I'm talking about. It's clear to me, you don't.

2. Being the person needing the assistance, and going to the various options for that assistance is the ONLY true research. If you had the experience, you would know that. There is no other way to truly ascertain which option serves you better. And that is OBVIOUS, to the intelligent.

3. HA HA HA. Where in the world do you get these crazy ideas ? Socialist govt has NOTHING to do with gun control. Hear that ? NOTHING. NADA. ZERO. SOcialist govt merely sees to it that EVERYONE in the society is provided for. Actually, if a govt was a truly socialist one, and truly concerned with their citizens, they WOULD ISSUE guns to citizens (like food $$) or special vouchers to buy self-protection guns.

4. Old Indian saying "Never judge a man until you walk a mile in his mocassins" When you get poor, THEN you can talk about what you'll do about it. In the meantime, you don't have a clue.

5. Congratulations, you DID agree with me on at least one thing (and you avoided a complete SHUTOUT). :giggle:

Protectionist · Jan 10, 2013

chris7375 said:
The funny thing is he assumes I have never used the system.

Many years ago I was on it though that was 12 years ago.

I have experience using the system. I was all for the system until I started looking deeper into the system. My views changed because I saw the Government can't run programs like that effectively.

Though I have experience I did outside research to come to my conclusion.

I did not assume anything. I went with what YOU had said earlier on in a post somewhere, where you said you had NOT used welfare. SO which is it ? Did you or didn't you ? At this point, I've learned to take what you say with a grain of salt.

Also, where do you get the idea the "Government can't run programs like that effectively." From my REAL experience with receiving food stamps I have found it to be 100% perfect, and that's over a 2 year period. My experience shows that your research and your conclusion are both wrong.

I will concede one point. Since my REAL experience is within the last 2 years, and the "experience" that you claim you had, allegedly, was 12 years ago, that time difference could be a factor in making a difference. For relevance to the life we live now though, my current REAL experience does trump your 12 year ago alleged "experience".

chris7375 · Jan 10, 2013

Protectionist said:
1. Unlike you, I have BEEN THERE. I've been poor enough to need assistancfe (and still am now). And I can tell FROM EXPERIENCE, the Church's do help but it's nowhere near enough. Without my food stamp benefit, I'd be starving right now. I know what I'm talking about. It's clear to me, you don't.

Oh but you are wrong I have used the assistance before. So that is where you are wrong. When my first wife was sick while she was Pregnant with my son I used it. I also used it when I got laid off up north 9 years ago so I do talk from experience. Despite your judgmental attitude which many could do without. You are not the sole air that has used this program. I have been there done that and seen what people got away with. I also used charities to help and found it much easier and they were more willing to help. Whereas I had to fight tooth and nail to get the government to help. When my first wife got sick with breast cancer I went to charities for help not the Government like I did the first time and we made out just fine up until her death. So for you to say I have no experience. My Experience in some ways far out weighs your own. I pull from my own life experience and the ways the system can be taken advantage of and is by many people.

Protectionist said:
2. Being the person needing the assistance, and going to the various options for that assistance is the ONLY true research. If you had the experience, you would know that. There is no other way to truly ascertain which option serves you better. And that is OBVIOUS, to the intelligent.

I appreciate you calling me Unintelligent. You know your threads show the type of person you truly are a bitter one at best. I did for the world so the world should do for me. Wrong attitude. No you are wrong though experience is one way of research it is not the only way. Experience should be the guiding point to try and learn more about a subject rather then jus rely on your experience. There are many sides to a subject. Though you would not know because if we don't agree with you we are all wrong.

Protectionist said:
3. HA HA HA. Where in the world do you get these crazy ideas ? Socialist govt has NOTHING to do with gun control. Hear that ? NOTHING. NADA. ZERO. SOcialist govt merely sees to it that EVERYONE in the society is provided for. Actually, if a govt was a truly socialist one, and truly concerned with their citizens, they WOULD ISSUE guns to citizens (like food $$) or special vouchers to buy self-protection guns.

A socialist government is the good of the many correct? That is a basic stance a socialist government has or am I wrong. So if a leader deems gun are not for the benefit of the many their they go.

Protectionist said:
4. Old Indian saying "Never judge a man until you walk a mile in his mocassins" When you get poor, THEN you can talk about what you'll do about it. In the meantime, you don't have a clue.

You should follow your own advice it could be helpful to you. You talk the talk but you are far from walking the walk.

Protectionist said:
5. Congratulations, you DID agree with me on at least one thing (and you avoided a complete SHUTOUT). :giggle:

Miracles do happen.

Protectionist · Jan 10, 2013

chris7375 said:
Oh but you are wrong I have used the assistance before. So that is where you are wrong. When my first wife was sick while she was Pregnant with my son I used it. I also used it when I got laid off up north 9 years ago so I do talk from experience. Despite your judgmental attitude which many could do without. You are not the sole air that has used this program. I have been there done that and seen what people got away with. I also used charities to help and found it much easier and they were more willing to help. Whereas I had to fight tooth and nail to get the government to help. When my first wife got sick with breast cancer I went to charities for help not the Government like I did the first time and we made out just fine up until her death. So for you to say I have no experience. My Experience in some ways far out weighs your own. I pull from my own life experience and the ways the system can be taken advantage of and is by many people.

But you are making it look like YOU are who's wrong - because YOU are the one who previoulsy said you DIDN'T use the assistance. Maybe you forgot, huh ? LOL. That's the problem with lying. If you don't remember every lie, or what you previously said, then you find yourself caught in a web of contradictions, which you created. So which is it ? Did you or didn't you ? At this point, I'd have to say, who cares ? When someone as little credible as you talks, it's a waste of perfectly good time.

chris7375 said:
I appreciate you calling me Unintelligent. You know your threads show the type of person you truly are a bitter one at best. I did for the world so the world should do for me. Wrong attitude. No you are wrong though experience is one way of research it is not the only way. Experience should be the guiding point to try and learn more about a subject rather then jus rely on your experience. There are many sides to a subject. Though you would not know because if we don't agree with you we are all wrong.

I did not call you Unintelligent.

I did for the world so the world should do for me. RIGHT attitude. Exactly the same attitude as what guides this country, that work and effort should result in reward. The American theme. Don't like it ? You could try Mexico, Syria, Egypt, or other such basketcases.

chris7375 said:
A socialist government is the good of the many correct? That is a basic stance a socialist government has or am I wrong. So if a leader deems gun are not for the benefit of the many their they go.

You are assuming because a govt is socialist, that determines it to be one-person totalitarian. As a rule, there is no such connection.

chris7375 said:
You should follow your own advice it could be helpful to you. You talk the talk but you are far from walking the walk.

This applies to YOU. Not at all to me. I am walking the walk in 5 different ways RIGHT NOW (Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, Food Stamps, & Assurance Wireless). I have never found statements so easy to refute.

chris7375 · Jan 10, 2013

Protectionist said:
But you are making it look like YOU are who's wrong - because YOU are the one who previoulsy said you DIDN'T use the assistance. Maybe you forgot, huh ? LOL. That's the problem with lying. If you don't remember every lie, or what you previously said, then you find yourself caught in a web of contradictions, which you created. So which is it ? Did you or didn't you ? At this point, I'd have to say, who cares ? When someone as little credible as you talks, it's a waste of perfectly good time.

I did not call you Unintelligent.

I did for the world so the world should do for me. RIGHT attitude. Exactly the same attitude as what guides this country, that work and effort should result in reward. The American theme. Don't like it ? You could try Mexico, Syria, Egypt, or other such basketcases.

You are assuming because a govt is socialist, that determines it to be one-person totalitarian. As a rule, there is no such connection.

This applies to YOU. Not at all to me. I am walking the walk in 5 different ways RIGHT NOW (Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, Food Stamps, & Assurance Wireless). I have never found statements so easy to refute.

First what I said was I would never use the assistance you are correct. At no time during our conversation did I ever say I never did not use at one point in my life so follow along. Again I have posted valid links to back my argument. You posted one valid link that is shaky at best to proving your point.

So the way I see it the one who is the least credible is not me. Refuting statement is one thing backing up why you refute them is something completely different.

You should really learn how it works. You want to talk down to me fine you want to rant you anti islam crap be my guest. Though when someone counters your points you should back them up with info people can look at.

Not well this is true because I said it.

Gottago · Jan 10, 2013

Protectionist said:
1. What is ACA ?

Affordable Care Act, what some call Obamacare.

2. I receive EBT (AKA SNAP) because my Social Security payment is to low to support buying food. And I'm an American born veteran, and taxpayer for 50 years. I've paid into this when I wasn't using it for half a century. Now that I'm no longer working and need it, you think I shouldn't get it ? That's absurd. If you were talking about someone who's never been out working or some illegal aliens, then sure THEY shouldn't get it, and for those who are rich (right now), they never know when they might need it someday.

Did I say to end the porgram? No. Now, calculate how much you've paid in, and how much you take out.... and know that the rest of the working USA is making up the difference.

3. The progressive tax rates enacted now (39.6%) you call "punishment" ? HA HA HA. You must be really young. Since Reagan was president, taxes on the rich have been ABNORMALLY LOW. Maybe those rates are the only ones you've ever known. Not me. I remember well when top tax rates were NORMAL (70%+). To say putting a rate at 40% "punishment" is hilarious. If there's any punishment going on, it's the American people who have been punished for the last 30 years, with much too low tax rates, and a corresponding shortage of services.

No, I'm not really young, I am more than half way through my working life. The entire population enjoyed those low tax rates, for which we now pay a price, but only the high income group should pay the piper? Why?

4. As to a 'rich' person being disabled in an accident, THERE ARE NO "ARRANGEMENTS" you can make if you (because of a life-long expensive aliment) become a big liability (LO$$) to an insurance company instead of the gain you once were. What do you think insurance companies are in business for ? To see that you're OK ? They don't give a rat's ass if you live or die, their motive is PROFIT, period. You become a high cost liability to them, and you're history. Then, you start paying out of your pocket. And if your medical/personal care is say $5 million/year, in 10 years, you're out $50 million. If you don't have it, you better hope medicaid is around.

You don't need to try and lecture me about insurance, I deal with it on a daily basis. And all the ACA was, was a gift to the insurance industry. No clinics, no incentives for additional GP's to train, no addressing of the actual driving costs of healthcare.

So you obviously prefer to to depend on others contributions to a societal pool, rather than plan for yourself, preferably someone who makes more money than you do. Got it!

Protectionist · Jan 10, 2013

chris7375 said:
You should really learn how it works. You want to talk down to me fine you want to rant you anti islam crap be my guest. Though when someone counters your points you should back them up with info people can look at.

1. HA HA. Oh I just knew that was coming next. So now it's my job, to painfully scour through the threads looking for your previous comments , right ? Wrong!

2. SO now I'll say I have quite often backed up my points with info people can look at, and I'll back THAT statement up too, right now with THIS:

http://counterterrorismblog.org/upload/2007/12/nefaikhwan1007%5B1%5D.pdf

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Post # 38 >> http://www.politicalfray.com/showthread.php?p=34855#post34855

US Constitution, Article 6, Section 2 (the Supremacy Clause); US Code 2384 (Seditious Conspiracy)

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Post # 42 >> http://www.politicalfray.com/showthread.php?p=34855#post34855

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/0...n_1285323.html

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Peace/2...up-Chicago-bar

http://www.fontcraft.com/broadside/?p=673927

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_Ti...ombing_attempt

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cargo_planes_bomb_plot

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ound-bomb.html

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/...80823Q20120109

http://undhimmi.com/2009/12/26/bomb-...uslim-student/

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/...lot/55191776/1

http://www.lomaxreport.com/news2_012.htm

http://creepingsharia.wordpress.com/...mb-skyscraper/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2001_shoe_bomb_plot

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006_tr..._aircraft_plot

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northwe...nes_Flight_253

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Post # 43 >>> http://www.politicalfray.com/showthread.php?p=34855#post34855

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinio...14a_story.html

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Post # 49 >>> >>> http://www.politicalfray.com/showthread.php?t=3295&page=4

"I shall cast terror into the hearts of the infidels. Strike off their heads, strike off the very tips of their fingers."
Quran 8:12, "The Spoils," Dawood, p. 177

"When the sacred months are over slay the idolaters wherever you find them. Arrest them, besiege them, and lie in ambush everywhere for them."

Quran 9:5; "Repentance," Dawood, p. 186

"Prophet, make war on the unbelievers and the hypocrites and deal rigorously with them. Hell shall be their home: an evil fate."[/SIZE]

Quran 9:73, "Repentance," Dawood, p. 198

"Believers, make war on the infidels who dwell around you. Deal firmly with them. Know that God is with the righteous."
Quran 9:123, "Repentance," Dawood, p. 206

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POst # 53 >>> http://www.politicalfray.com/showthread.php?t=3295&page=4

Muslim Brotherhood front groups in America (as designated by US Justice Dept)

CAIR, ISNA, MAS, MSA, ICNA, FCNA, MAYA, AEF, UASR, IAP, BMI, IIIT, IMANA, AMSE, ICNA, Islamic Institute, AMC, AMF, Success Foundation, GSISS AKA Cordoba University, NAIF, IIFTIKHAR, AMSS, TIAA, IRO, African Muslim Agency, Safa Trust, SAAR Foundation, MMCT, Dar El-Eiman USA, ADAMS, IANA, GRF, MWL, MYNA, HHT, Islamic Academy of Florida, Fairfax Institute, AMT, IIFSO, AMCE, AMAFVAC, CISNA, Islamic Media Foundation, et al

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Post # 64 >>> (letter from al-Zawahiri to al-Zarqawi, July 8, 2005) http://www.globalsecurity.org/securi...r_9jul2005.htm

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Post # 66 >>> Muslim Brotherhood front groups in America

http://muslimbrotherhoodinamerica.com/

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Post # 72 >>> US Constitution Article 6, Section 2 (the Supremacy Clause)

"This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in Pursuance thereof; and all Treaties made, or which shall be made, under the Authority of the United States, shall be the supreme Law of the Land; and the Judges in every State shall be bound thereby, any Thing in the Constitution or Laws of any State to the Contrary notwithstanding."

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Post # 79 >>> http://www.politicalfray.com/showthread.php?t=3295&page=6

Mohamed Akram, "An Explanatory Memorandum on the General Strategic Goal for the Group in North America" May 22, 1991, Government Exhibit 003-0085, United States vs. Holy Land Foundation, et al.

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Post # 82 >>> http://www.politicalfray.com/showthread.php?t=3295&page=6

In the words of Baitullah Mehsud, a Taliban leader in Afghanistan, and bin Laden supporter >>> "Allah, on 480 occasions in the holy Koran extols Muslims to wage jihad. We only fulfill God's orders. Only jihad can bring peace to the world. We will continue our struggle until foreign troops are thrown out. Then we will attack them in the U.S. and Britain until they either accept Islam or agree to pay jizyah."

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Post # 88 - http://www.politicalfray.com/showthread.php?t=3295&page=6

Book of Leviticus (from Greek Λευιτικός, Leuitikos, meaning "relating to the Levites"; Hebrew: ויקרא, Vayikra, "the Hebrew Bible, ; Persian period (538–332 BC) - hundreds of years before the birth of Christ.

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Post # 115 >>> http://www.politicalfray.com/showthread.php?t=3295&page=8

http://shariahinamericancourts.com/

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Post # 116 >>> http://www.politicalfray.com/showthread.php?t=3295&page=8

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friendly_fire

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Protectionist · Jan 10, 2013

Addendum to Post # 55. I could have added more source material, but the forum has a maximum of 10,000 characters, so I had to shorten it down, to fit.

Also note that these are all just from ONE thread alone.

And YES, I should back them up with info people can look at. And I just proved that I do just that. Now here's a tip for you. You should NOT go around throwing FALSE smear talk at other posters, only to be disproved afterwards. Are you watching Mr. Moderator ?

Stonewall · Jan 11, 2013

Protectionist said:
I did not assume anything. I went with what YOU had said earlier on in a post somewhere, where you said you had NOT used welfare. SO which is it ? Did you or didn't you ? At this point, I've learned to take what you say with a grain of salt.

Also, where do you get the idea the "Government can't run programs like that effectively." From my REAL experience with receiving food stamps I have found it to be 100% perfect, and that's over a 2 year period. My experience shows that your research and your conclusion are both wrong.

I will concede one point. Since my REAL experience is within the last 2 years, and the "experience" that you claim you had, allegedly, was 12 years ago, that time difference could be a factor in making a difference. For relevance to the life we live now though, my current REAL experience does trump your 12 year ago alleged "experience".

So where is the real experience attained. From using government services...or paying for them?

Protectionist · Jan 11, 2013

Gottago said:
Affordable Care Act, what some call Obamacare.

Did I say to end the porgram? No. Now, calculate how much you've paid in, and how much you take out.... and know that the rest of the working USA is making up the difference.
No, I'm not really young, I am more than half way through my working life. The entire population enjoyed those low tax rates, for which we now pay a price, but only the high income group should pay the piper? Why?
You don't need to try and lecture me about insurance, I deal with it on a daily basis. And all the ACA was, was a gift to the insurance industry. No clinics, no incentives for additional GP's to train, no addressing of the actual driving costs of healthcare.

So you obviously prefer to to depend on others contributions to a societal pool, rather than plan for yourself, preferably someone who makes more money than you do. Got it!

I don't know exactly how to calculate all I've paid into Social Security for 50 years, but I'd guess it's a whole lot more than I've been taking out for 3 years. (with ME making up the difference). And NO, the "entire population" did NOT enjoy those low tax rates. In fact, while Reagan lowered taxes for the top bracket down to a record 28%, he RAISED taxes on the bottom bracket (from 11% to 15%), a whopping 36% INCREASE on the poorest people in America.

As for why the high income group should pay the piper, it's understandable that the biggest takers should be the biggest givers (not Reagan's idea of taking from the poor to give to the rich)

I am no fan of the insurance industry believe me. Their PIP here in Florida is outright THEFT, and how they get away with it I still haven't figured out.
But having health insurance guaranteed for all is normal. Every other advanced country has it, and rich people in America should support just on moral principle alone + the fact that they may not always be rich and they may need it. In fact a serious(and medically-expensive) lifelong ailment is exactly what could turn them into a riches-to-rags story in a hurry.

I am not depending on others' contributions to a societal pool, I'm receiving from my own contributions (taxes) paid for 50 years (and I still pay sales taxes), and if you are considerably younger than me (I'm 66), then YOU are depending upon contributions that I have made for a long time before you were contributing anything. You're Welcome. You might also note that due to the cheapskate wages that many employers pay, many employees are unable to "plan" anything/ever (that being an activity within the rich class). Got THAT ?

http://www.ntu.org/tax-basics/history-of-federal-individual-1.html

Protectionist · Jan 11, 2013

Stonewall said:
So where is the real experience attained. From using government services...or paying for them?

For the conversation we were having, using them is the real experience.

For another conversation, paying for them might be applicable. In that conversation, we would include the 50 years+ that many seniors paid taxes, and did not receive a dime, before they became old enough for their "government services". And many (including me) served a few years in the military as well.

Budget Cuts ? UNACCEPTABLE ANSWER

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