Is Islam a Religion

David · Dec 31, 2012

clax said:
Not really a small sect, quite a large sect in fact.

If just 1% of Muslims were terrorists we'd have an army 1 million strong trying to kill us. If AQ had those numbers, they'd of invaded and occupied NY and DC, not knock down a few buildings. Trust me, if they were anything other then a small sect, we'd all probably be dead right now.

Protectionist · Jan 2, 2013

tecoyah said:
I have reviewed as you suggest, and see nothing disrespectful in my replies. I take it from the decision not to show me where these comments exist, that they simply do not and you instead have an issue with me.

Your impotent and poorly veiled final line is rather silly, as my membership is not at risk...as of right now, YOURS IS.

I would guess anyone's member ship could be at risk. As for your indiscretions, you reviewed nothing, and you know perfectly well what they are. You need to shape up. You're nasty.

Protectionist · Jan 2, 2013

David said:
If just 1% of Muslims were terrorists we'd have an army 1 million strong trying to kill us. If AQ had those numbers, they'd of invaded and occupied NY and DC, not knock down a few buildings. Trust me, if they were anything other then a small sect, we'd all probably be dead right now.

Numbers are overrated. ONE single terrorist with a suitcase nuclear bomb could kill thousands, if not millions, depending on the location. One or 2 with a biological agent cold kill millions all over the USA, as the agent spread from people to people and state to state by plane and rail.

Protectionist · Jan 2, 2013

This thread has gotten OFF TOPIC.

clax · Jan 2, 2013

Protectionist said:
This thread has gotten OFF TOPIC.

No, it hasn't. Most people just don't accept your personal bent on Islam. You have the right to think what you wish as do I.

You say that comparing Islam to other religions in an effort to define it was off topic, that was the topic.

Saying something is off topic is off topic also. I am not going to play ball in your narrow bounds, that isn't how conversion works.

But it really seems as though you can't have the disagreement. Perhaps debate is not for you.

David · Jan 3, 2013

Protectionist said:
Numbers are overrated. ONE single terrorist with a suitcase nuclear bomb could kill thousands, if not millions, depending on the location. One or 2 with a biological agent cold kill millions all over the USA, as the agent spread from people to people and state to state by plane and rail.

That doesn't really have anything to do with whether or not a population is largely made up of terrorists.

Protectionist · Jan 7, 2013

clax said:
No, it hasn't. Most people just don't accept your personal bent on Islam. You have the right to think what you wish as do I.

You say that comparing Islam to other religions in an effort to define it was off topic, that was the topic.

Saying something is off topic is off topic also. I am not going to play ball in your narrow bounds, that isn't how conversion works.

But it really seems as though you can't have the disagreement. Perhaps debate is not for you.

Translation: You would PREFER if I didn't debate here. :giggle:

Protectionist · Jan 7, 2013

David said:
That doesn't really have anything to do with whether or not a population is largely made up of terrorists.

Whether or not a population is largely made up of terrorists, doesn't really have anything to do with whether or not a population has a single terrorist working at killing millions with nukes or biologicals. The latter is, by far, the more important point.

chris7375 · Jan 7, 2013

Protectionist said:
Whether or not a population is largely made up of terrorists, doesn't really have anything to do with whether or not a population has a single terrorist working at killing millions with nukes or biologicals. The latter is, by far, the more important point.

We have the ability to kill millions with nukes our nukes are controlled at most a half dozen people. What if one snaps and decides to use them. What are the real chances of this happening?

Then would you also not think if we pulled out of the ME they would leave us alone if we did the same?

David · Jan 7, 2013

Protectionist said:
Whether or not a population is largely made up of terrorists, doesn't really have anything to do with whether or not a population has a single terrorist working at killing millions with nukes or biologicals. The latter is, by far, the more important point.

By that logic every demographic aside from the Amish and Hippies are a threat.

myp · Jan 7, 2013

David said:
By that logic every demographic aside from the Amish and Hippies are a threat.

Depending on how you are defining populations, they might be included too. Guess we're all terrorists now? Hmm...

Protectionist · Jan 7, 2013

David said:
By that logic every demographic aside from the Amish and Hippies are a threat.

Not at all. The Amish and Hippies are pacifists. The Islamists are warmongering supremacists, bent on world conquest.

Protectionist · Jan 7, 2013

chris7375 said:
We have the ability to kill millions with nukes our nukes are controlled at most a half dozen people. What if one snaps and decides to use them. What are the real chances of this happening?

Then would you also not think if we pulled out of the ME they would leave us alone if we did the same?

First of all, I'm not sure who the "they" is that you're talking about. In any case, neither the violent jihadists (al Qaeda) or the nonviolent stealth jihadists (Muslim Brotherhood) would leave us alone. Of course not. They won't leave us alone until they achieve their goal of worldwide caliphate.

"The process of settlement [of Islam in the United States] is a "Civilization-Jihadist" process with all that the word means. The Ikhwan [Muslim Brotherhood in North America] must understand that all their work in America is a kind of grand jihad in eliminating and destroying the Western civilization from within and "sabotaging" their miserable house by their hands, and the hands of the believers so that it is eliminated, and Allah's religion is made victorious over all religions."

Mohamed Akram, "An Explanatory Memorandum on the General Strategic Goal for the Group in North America" May 22, 1991, Government Exhibit 003-0085, United States vs. Holy Land Foundation, et al

And the words of Osama bin Laden ? >>> In an al Qaeda training manual, bin Laden attributed the loss of the caliphate to a malaise in the Muslim world.

"The bitter situation that the nation has reached is a result of its divergence from Allah's course and his righteous law for all places and times. That [situation] came about as a result of its children's love for the world, their loathing of death, and their abandonment of jihad." (al Qaeda training manual, http://www.fas.org/irp/world/para/laden.htm.)

Bin Laden, in his "State of Jihad" speech on Al-Jazeera also said: "The Umma and its youth, women, elderly, must offer themselves, their expertise, and all sort of financial support enough to raise jihad in the battlefields of jihad. Jihad today is a duty of every Muslim."

tecoyah · Jan 8, 2013

Just a point to consider...Bin Laden, the Muslim Brotherhood, and any other person, organization, or state you choose are NOT Islam, anymore than the Westboro church is Christianity.

Both may claim to be a "Part" of the religion...but they are a mere sliver off the bark of the tree.

bluefig · Jan 8, 2013

Armed conflict in order to convert or kill nonbelievers is part of the religion of Islam as is the routine assault of women and gays. For sure, the Christian Bible does sanction violence also but one has to look at the number of attacks related to the teachings to see how big the problem may be. Westboro Church is Christianity but then, they aren't bombing people, either, just being a big nuisance, which is totally legal. There is also the question of culture and it is unclear how many technically Islamic people, for example, batter their wives and slaves because of culture instead of a steadfast following of the words in the Koran. It's hard to pin that down.

tecoyah · Jan 8, 2013

bluefig said:
Armed conflict in order to convert or kill nonbelievers is part of the religion of Islam as is the routine assault of women and gays. For sure, the Christian Bible does sanction violence also but one has to look at the number of attacks related to the teachings to see how big the problem may be. Westboro Church is Christianity but then, they aren't bombing people, either, just being a big nuisance, which is totally legal. There is also the question of culture and it is unclear how many technically Islamic people, for example, batter their wives and slaves because of culture instead of a steadfast following of the words in the Koran. It's hard to pin that down.

I see the general culture in the ME as another major factor in the backward nature of Islam. The entire region was forced into a backward posture when Islam became prominent, and has stayed that way for a very long time. With advancement in technology, infrastructure, quality of life, and Government these things inevitably change.

Until these people discard the bridle of stagnation...they will stay in the middle ages.

chris7375 · Jan 8, 2013

Protectionist said:
First of all, I'm not sure who the "they" is that you're talking about. In any case, neither the violent jihadists (al Qaeda) or the nonviolent stealth jihadists (Muslim Brotherhood) would leave us alone. Of course not. They won't leave us alone until they achieve their goal of worldwide caliphate.

"The process of settlement [of Islam in the United States] is a "Civilization-Jihadist" process with all that the word means. The Ikhwan [Muslim Brotherhood in North America] must understand that all their work in America is a kind of grand jihad in eliminating and destroying the Western civilization from within and "sabotaging" their miserable house by their hands, and the hands of the believers so that it is eliminated, and Allah's religion is made victorious over all religions."

Mohamed Akram, "An Explanatory Memorandum on the General Strategic Goal for the Group in North America" May 22, 1991, Government Exhibit 003-0085, United States vs. Holy Land Foundation, et al

And the words of Osama bin Laden ? >>> In an al Qaeda training manual, bin Laden attributed the loss of the caliphate to a malaise in the Muslim world.

"The bitter situation that the nation has reached is a result of its divergence from Allah's course and his righteous law for all places and times. That [situation] came about as a result of its children's love for the world, their loathing of death, and their abandonment of jihad." (al Qaeda training manual, http://www.fas.org/irp/world/para/laden.htm.)

Bin Laden, in his "State of Jihad" speech on Al-Jazeera also said: "The Umma and its youth, women, elderly, must offer themselves, their expertise, and all sort of financial support enough to raise jihad in the battlefields of jihad. Jihad today is a duty of every Muslim."

Come on now how do you not understand who they means? Really you can't figure out I am talking about the terrorists. You are the one who has been bashing a belief that you say spawns terrorist. I disagree what spawns terrorists is a foreign occupation.

The only thing they want is to be left alone and rightfully so. You said I am like Republican robot which is so far from the truth. How I see you is someone who carries hate for people without a true understanding of the situation at hand.

You actually remind a lot of my Grandfather. You educate yourself on one side of the issue.

Your hatred for Muslims is hard to fathom. In all retrospect then we should consider the Vietnamese Terrorists because they fought us with any means they could find. Let us not consider the fact we invade their country. I mean God forbid they fight us because we were an invading force.

REALLY please those people in the ME look at us the same way we looked at the British when we fought for our independence. If we left them alone they (TERRORISTS) would leave us alone. That is what they want and have asked for for years. They don't want to be occupied anymore then any other country does and are willing to fight to prove their point. The means may be less then desired, but so it could be said for any battle in history.

tecoyah · Jan 8, 2013

Protectionist said:
Translation: You would PREFER if I didn't debate here. :giggle:

Actual Translation~

Few share your extreme views, yet are civil in stating they do not agree.

chris7375 · Jan 8, 2013

tecoyah said:
I see the general culture in the ME as another major factor in the backward nature of Islam. The entire region was forced into a backward posture when Islam became prominent, and has stayed that way for a very long time. With advancement in technology, infrastructure, quality of life, and Government these things inevitably change.

Until these people discard the bridle of stagnation...they will stay in the middle ages.

Though in truth it is not our job to bring them out of the darkness. This is why they fight us tooth and nail.

tecoyah · Jan 8, 2013

chris7375 said:
Though in truth it is not our job to bring them out of the darkness. This is why they fight us tooth and nail.

Agreed...I wish we would simply let them alone, and watch them kill each other from a distance.

Not worth caring about...until they spill it over the borders.

Is Islam a Religion

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