Should the United States Cease to Exist?

David · Sep 19, 2017

Road Warrior said:
A slight disagreement. That's like saying "The US has ALWAYS emulated the Brits." It's more truthful to say that both the Romans and the Brits are a very important part of American culture and history. Rome, because it conquered and influenced nearly all of Europe and Britain for a more direct lineage in our history.

Mussolini wanted to restore Italy to the power and respect of the Roman empire, so he used much of it in his fascist government including the Roman fasces.

https://www.britannica.com/topic/fasces
Fasces, insignia of official authority in ancient Rome. The name derives from the plural form of the Latin fascis (“bundle”).

It's a bit more than a causal influence when you base your entire culture on Rome. It's not just symbolism, the Senate, the House (Popular Assembly), the neo-classical architecture, several attempts at making Latin and/or Greek the official language, explicit citing of Rome, the dual presidency (Co-Councilship), etc.

It's not a 1:1, the British Empire and Iroquois Confederation and Freemasons were big influences as well but the US was BASED, not merely inspired, on the Roman Republic.

numan · Sep 24, 2017

'
Let's Give Up on the Constitution

AS the nation teeters at the edge of fiscal chaos, observers are reaching the conclusion that the American system of government is broken. But almost no one blames the culprit: our insistence on obedience to the Constitution, with all its archaic, idiosyncratic and downright evil provisions....

If even this change is impossible, perhaps the dream of a country ruled by “We the people” is impossibly utopian. If so, we have to give up on the claim that we are a self-governing people who can settle our disagreements through mature and tolerant debate. But before abandoning our heritage of self-government, we ought to try extricating ourselves from constitutional bondage so that we can give real freedom a chance.

An op-ed in the august New York Times.

More and more people are waking up to the fact that the present US Constitution is an outmoded 18th century document in the 21st century and needs desperately to be replaced by a plan of government fitted to the times in which we live.
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tecoyah · Sep 24, 2017

numan said:
'
Let's Give Up on the Constitution

An op-ed in the august New York Times.

More and more people are waking up to the fact that the present US Constitution is an outmoded 18th century document in the 21st century and needs desperately to be replaced by a plan of government fitted to the times in which we live.
.

And thus is the amendment process important and utilized.

arcturus88 · Sep 25, 2017

when you realize that every post about America by numan is an effort (though perhaps unconscious) to ease painful guilt and remorse, it makes more sense.

Something like this:

I betrayed X which makes me feel painful emotions like guilt and regret.

If I paint X as a villain at all cost and at every turn, then guilt subsides.

numan · Feb 23, 2018

'
The "War on Terror" as Defined by 1984's Emmanuel Goldstein

The social atmosphere is that of a besieged city.. And at the same time the consciousness of being at war, and therefore in danger, makes the handing-over of all power to a small caste seem the natural, unavoidable condition of survival."

"Crimestop means the faculty of stopping short, as though by instinct, at the threshold of any dangerous thought. It includes the power of not grasping analogies, of failing to perceive logical errors, of misunderstanding the simplest arguments if they are inimical to Ingsoc, and of being bored or repelled by any train of thought which is capable of leading in a heretical direction. Crimestop, in short, means protective stupidity."

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mcstites · Feb 23, 2018

arcturus88 said:
when you realize that every post about America by numan is an effort (though perhaps unconscious) to ease painful guilt and remorse, it makes more sense.

Something like this:

I betrayed X which makes me feel painful emotions like guilt and regret.

If I paint X as a villain at all cost and at every turn, then guilt subsides.

I think you got it. He ran and now he is trying to compensate with hate.

Ralph47 · Feb 23, 2018

mcstites said:
I think you got it. He ran and now he is trying to compensate with hate.

It is high time he quit living in the past, and try the present for a change, before it is too late!!! :redface:

Ralph47 · Feb 23, 2018

Hey numan, isn't there someone you can talk to (in person) to get these nagging issue off your chest for once & for all? :unsure:

numan · Feb 24, 2018

'
George Orwell described the nature of all modern forms of government in his allegorical novel, 1984. His term for this form of government was oligarchical socialism.

"Oligarchical Socialism" is in fact the form of social control exercised in the USA since the end of World War II; it replaced the laissez faire capitalism that came before it.

Socialism can be defined as the providing of certain human needs by the state instead of by the private sector. These needs can be health care, education, or just general financial support to promote the general welfare of the society.

Oligarchical Socialism, on the other hand, provides these same support mechanisms but to a very limited number of recipients, usually called "The Upper Classes", and it uses the combined resources of the society to provide those needs.

In other words, while only a small number of individuals (government, business, special groups) are receiving these benefits, the collective mass of society pays for them. You pay, but don't get anything in return.

If this system seems unfair, it's because it is; but it is successful, having tranferred most of the wealth and power of the society to roughly 1% of the top families. The mechanisms that perform this feat are the forces of taxation, subsidization, tokenization of wealth and regulation which can be used by those that control the government to direct the collective wealth into their hands.

On first sight, one would expect that this system would fail because of the unfairness of the system to the people who are doing the work which creates the wealth of the society. Ordinarily this is true, but this system needs to have one ability in order to survive its apparent dilemma: that is the ability to propagandize the laboring masses into thinking the system works for them.

Ours is the most effective system of indoctrination ever created because it relies on the fullfillment of subconscious desires in the human mind. It was carefully crafted by Freud's disciple Bernays in the 1920's through what is now known as "Public Relations" and has replaced religion as the most successful form of social control.
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[In America] we have socialism for the rich and free enterprise for the poor.
---- Gore Vidal
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mcstites · Feb 24, 2018

numan said:
'
George Orwell described the nature of all modern forms of government in his allegorical novel, 1984. His term for this form of government was oligarchical socialism.

"Oligarchical Socialism" is in fact the form of social control exercised in the USA since the end of World War II; it replaced the laissez faire capitalism that came before it.

Socialism can be defined as the providing of certain human needs by the state instead of by the private sector. These needs can be health care, education, or just general financial support to promote the general welfare of the society.

Oligarchical Socialism, on the other hand, provides these same support mechanisms but to a very limited number of recipients, usually called "The Upper Classes", and it uses the combined resources of the society to provide those needs.

In other words, while only a small number of individuals (government, business, special groups) are receiving these benefits, the collective mass of society pays for them. You pay, but don't get anything in return.

If this system seems unfair, it's because it is; but it is successful, having tranferred most of the wealth and power of the society to roughly 1% of the top families. The mechanisms that perform this feat are the forces of taxation, subsidization, tokenization of wealth and regulation which can be used by those that control the government to direct the collective wealth into their hands.

On first sight, one would expect that this system would fail because of the unfairness of the system to the people who are doing the work which creates the wealth of the society. Ordinarily this is true, but this system needs to have one ability in order to survive its apparent dilemma: that is the ability to propagandize the laboring masses into thinking the system works for them.

Ours is the most effective system of indoctrination ever created because it relies on the fullfillment of subconscious desires in the human mind. It was carefully crafted by Freud's disciple Bernays in the 1920's through what is now known as "Public Relations" and has replaced religion as the most successful form of social control.
----------------------------------------------------------

[In America] we have socialism for the rich and free enterprise for the poor.
---- Gore Vidal
.

I have no idea what you are trying to say. However, I and the vast majority of the people I know are living very comfortably. The few people who I would call rich are rich because they worked harder and smarter than everyone else.

numan · Feb 24, 2018

mcstites said:
I have no idea what you are trying to say. However, I and the vast majority of the people I know are living very comfortably. The few people who I would call rich are rich because they worked harder and smarter than everyone else.

Oh, dear! Oh, dear! What laughably primitive ideas! I know, of course, that they are wide spread among brainwashed Americans and those of that ilk!

If we were back in the days of Adam, when, perforce, men earned their livelihood by the sweat of their brow, there would be some sense in what you have written; but we do live in somewhat different conditions than that mythical time!

In such complex societies as those today, where does one man's labour leave off and another's begin? It would take judges wiser than Solomon to decide such matters rightly!

More to the point, where does one man's chiseling and theft leave off and another's begin? The bottom 50% of society possess less than 10% of the wealth, and the top 1% have gathered to themselves more than 50% of the wealth.

I suppose it would take someone as brainwashed as an American to claim that the top one percent of the population had "earned" their wealth!

"Independence? That's middle-class blasphemy! We are all dependent on one another, every soul of us on earth!"
-- George Bernard Shaw
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Ralph47 · Feb 24, 2018

mcstites said:
I have no idea what you are trying to say. However, I and the vast majority of the people I know are living very comfortably. The few people who I would call rich are rich because they worked harder and smarter than everyone else.

mcstites · Feb 24, 2018

numan said:
Oh, dear! Oh, dear! What laughably primitive ideas! I know, of course, that they are wide spread among brainwashed Americans and those of that ilk!
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Through all that, you actually failed to say anything which contradicted what I said.

The wealthy I know work harder than any of their employees. They put their money at risk in their business. Without them, the employees would be unemployed. In other words, it could just as easily be said that the employees are taking advantage of their employers by not working as hard as they could. However, they both benefit from each other.

numan · Feb 24, 2018

mcstites said:
The wealthy I know work harder than any of their employees. They put their money at risk in their business. Without them, the employees would be unemployed. In other words, it could just as easily be said that the employees are taking advantage of their employers by not working as hard as they could. However, they both benefit from each other.

Iolo, we clearly need a few of your golden words!
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Ralph47 · Feb 24, 2018

mcstites said:
Through all that, you actually failed to say anything which contradicted what I said.

The wealthy I know work harder than any of their employees. They put their money at risk in their business. Without them, the employees would be unemployed. In other words, it could just as easily be said that the employees are taking advantage of their employers by not working as hard as they could. However, they both benefit from each other.

ESPECIALLY when they are on their smart phone or they're on the internet on their company PC much of the time!!! :redface:

numan · Feb 24, 2018

'
North Americans, and Americans in particular, are generally very uneducated and have poor powers of ratiocination. Laughably, they are also very proud of themselves, and very pig-headed. They learn nothing, and forget everything.

To keep things in perspective, remember:

No ruling class in history has been overthrown; they have all committed suicide.

No people in history have been more cut off from reality than Americans. Even Nazi Germany, compared with the USA, was a model of clear thinking, enlightened people. The collapse of the American system is certain, and it is not far off.

Unfortunately, like the savage kings of old, who, when they died, had their subjects and their animals slaughtered to accompany them in death, the ruling classes of America and the rest of the world will try to drag the rest of us down into their dance of death.

I think it is retrogressive to think of our situation as primarily a "left" versus "right" battle. That is so... so...20th century! I see it primarily as a confrontation between rationality and irrationality. Irrationality has tremendous momentum and must run its course until it crashes. Struggling with it is mainly a waste of energy. Nothing will be done until we live in a wasteland of rubble, and the survivors have had their faces ground down into the dirt of their hopes and delusions.

There are two images which seem to me to be especially apposite to our present time. Both are from the second "Jurassic Park" movie. A group of helpless, terrified humans are running in disorganized panic down a dark, muddy jungle path pursued by a tyrannosaurus rex. One guess what the dinosaur represents.

The other image is of the tyrannosaurus rex silhouetted against the glittering, modern city of San Diego. A dinosaur raging through San Diego is very like the Neocons and their ilk stalking through the twenty-first century.
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mcstites · Feb 24, 2018

numan said:
'
North Americans, and Americans in particular, are generally very uneducated and have poor powers of ratiocination. Laughably, they are also very proud of themselves, and very pig-headed. They learn nothing, and forget everything.
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And yet in spite of all our perceived weaknesses, we have survived very well over the years and will continue to survive.

Your bitterness is pathetic.

Ralph47 · Feb 24, 2018

mcstites said:
And yet in spite of all our perceived weaknesses, we have survived very well over the years and will continue to survive.

Your bitterness is pathetic.

Actually we THRIVE, not simply survive (like the Canucks).

numan · Feb 24, 2018

mcstites said:
Your bitterness is pathetic.

And your irrational red herrings are tedious.

It is a fact that large segments of the American population are extremely uniform in their thoughts and attitudes, and this uniformity does not arise from independent, rational analysis, but from the intense brainwashing that pervades every aspect of American life. So, yes, Americans in general are a very homogeneous bunch -- with some exceptions.

I haven't met any smart Americans yet -- ever. I myself wasn't smart until I left the USA. There is something in the atmosphere of the USA that stunts intelligence in everyone who is born there. The only intelligent people I ever met in the USA were foreigners who came to live there -- and I am not sure that it says much for their intelligence that they moved to the US.
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Ralph47 · Feb 24, 2018

numan said:
And your irrational red herrings are tedious.

It is a fact that large segments of the American population are extremely uniform in their thoughts and attitudes, and this uniformity does not arise from independent, rational analysis, but from the intense brainwashing that pervades every aspect of American life. So, yes, Americans in general are a very homogeneous bunch -- with some exceptions.

I haven't met any smart Americans yet -- ever. I myself wasn't smart until I left the USA. There is something in the atmosphere of the USA that stunts intelligence in everyone who is born there. The only intelligent people I ever met in the USA were foreigners who came to live there -- and I am not sure that it says much for their intelligence that they moved to the US.
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Your issues are very deep seated.