Stopping the illegal alien invasion

myp

Jan 2009
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Sure, but if I don't mow my grass or pile junk up in the yard the county will make me clean it up. But not old shopping centers and their lots. My opinion is the owners just do it for the tax breaks. When the tax breaks expire they just move on. They don't really care what happens then.
Well in that case it is the fault of the government for not making them clean up too, is it not?
 
Mar 2009
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Okay so it is not a probably with expansion/growth, now is it? :p
That is part of it. Things were much better here before we started outgrowing everything. It has required new schools, new water plant and huge expansion of the sewer system. And all that cost big money. Guess who's bills and taxes keep going up to pay for it.
 

myp

Jan 2009
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That is part of it. Things were much better here before we started outgrowing everything. It has required new schools, new water plant and huge expansion of the sewer system. And all that cost big money. Guess who's bills and taxes keep going up to pay for it.
You realize most of our expansion (in terms of relative immigration) was in the 1800s and early 1900s, right? Expansion was very good for us until government started cutting in more and more, establishing entitlements, and ending free immigration. Expansion and accepting all was the basis of the American dream.
 
Mar 2009
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You realize most of our expansion (in terms of relative immigration) was in the 1800s and early 1900s, right? Expansion was very good for us until government started cutting in more and more, establishing entitlements, and ending free immigration. Expansion and accepting all was the basis of the American dream.
You know I don't believe in the "American Dream"!:p Don't believe in Santa or the Easter Bunny either.;)
 

myp

Jan 2009
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You know I don't believe in the "American Dream"!:p Don't believe in Santa or the Easter Bunny either.;)
That's fine, but I am pretty sure you believe in the old America- the freer America, do you not? You often hint that I have been deceived by new schools of thought, but have you ever thought that even what you learned as you grew was a deception of an older school of thought- of one that was actually revolutionary on the scale of history? Your ideas here have been the norm for thousands of years- America ~1900 and parts of it before (and I believe the founding fathers too) broke that trend.
 
Aug 2011
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Well for one, many Americans expect a minimum wage as per the law. Furthermore, taking a job under minimum wage would mean they are not only breaking minimum wage laws, but also tax laws since they can't tell the government they are working at the rates they are- that often leads to tax evasion, which can be a serious crime. Risk aversion probably plays a big role too- the illegal alien is illegally here anyway and can get deported if caught- taking an illegal job won't make it much worse (and that is the reason they usually come any way).

And then there are other variables that could potentially be the reason as well- what is socially acceptable, quality/consistency, etc.

Good post, but this is why I say the law should be changed so that there is a real likely consequence for scofflaw employers. If there were, then things would change dramatically - for the better.
 
Aug 2011
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You folks are sadly confused. Both the Republicans and the Democrats, with the exception of a few politicians in the border states, are in favor of illegal immigration from Mexico and Central America. Cheap labor lets some businesses remain profitable, keeps the minimum wage down, and reduces the effect of the demographic bulge of the baby boom generation on the economy.

There are not enough politicians running in 2012 who would support a REAL controlled border and/or REAL crackdown on employers of illegals for such measures to ever be passed and enforced. Not to mention the fact that the next President to pass another amnesty bill will immediately get a couple of million new legal supporters.

If you build the wall, people will complain about the cost, the environment and the racism; if you crack down on employers, people will complain about the cost, the harassment of legitimate businesses and the racism. I'm all in favor of having a vision, but this one has blinkers on that fails to allow for a nasty little thing called reality.

I already said that democrats and some republicans (RINOs) support the invasion. Just saying that much is blurring the distinction between republicans and democrats: almost ALL democrats support the invasion, and FEW republicans support it - unfortunately, those few are in positions of power - the current GOP RINO establishment. And illegals would NOT support a president who signs an amnesty - they would all go to the party of freebies - the democrats.

Further, cracking down on employers would NOT cost a relatively large amount of money. Start throwing a few in prison for six months, and the rest will get the message pretty quick.
 

myp

Jan 2009
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Good post, but this is why I say the law should be changed so that there is a real likely consequence for scofflaw employers. If there were, then things would change dramatically - for the better.

Why not just eliminate the minimum wage?
 
Aug 2011
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Why not just eliminate the minimum wage?

I'm all for that, but I don't think it's sufficent - there are many other safety net things like food stamps and welfare which would stop many americans from taking the jobs at the wages paid illegals.
 
Mar 2009
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That's fine, but I am pretty sure you believe in the old America- the freer America, do you not? You often hint that I have been deceived by new schools of thought, but have you ever thought that even what you learned as you grew was a deception of an older school of thought- of one that was actually revolutionary on the scale of history? Your ideas here have been the norm for thousands of years- America ~1900 and parts of it before (and I believe the founding fathers too) broke that trend.
The America I grew up with is gone forever. I hope 40 or 50 years from now you don't feel like a alien from another planet in your own country. It is no fun to live everyday wishing it would be your last.
 

myp

Jan 2009
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The America I grew up with is gone forever. I hope 40 or 50 years from now you don't feel like a alien from another planet in your own country. It is no fun to live everyday wishing it would be your last.

The America you grew up in was also not sustainable (if it was the 50s-60s). It might have been a good time to live in, but that doesn't mean it can continue forever or that your time didn't just push off problems to the future. Think about the early 2000s- things were dandy, everyone was buying houses, but it didn't last because it was not sustainable.
 
Mar 2009
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The America you grew up in was also not sustainable (if it was the 50s-60s). It might have been a good time to live in, but that doesn't mean it can continue forever or that your time didn't just push off problems to the future. Think about the early 2000s- things were dandy, everyone was buying houses, but it didn't last because it was not sustainable.
2000 was as bad for me as 2011 is now. What you are not understanding is there has been no "better" for me since March 1984. It will never be better in anyway and I know it. That is hard to learn to like. A life with no real future is no damn picnic.

No hopes and no dreams.
 

myp

Jan 2009
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2000 was as bad for me as 2011 is now. What you are not understanding is there has been no "better" for me since March 1984. It will never be better in anyway and I know it. That is hard to learn to like. A life with no real future is no damn picnic.

No hopes and no dreams.

2000 was just an example. The point is that things being pleasant does not necessarily mean they will last or can last. Another example- if you get "high" off [insert drug of choice here], you feel great when you are high, but it does not last. Some things are not sustainable no matter what. In fact, they can be bad in the long term. A drug user saying "But I was happy when I was high" does not mean anything.
 
Mar 2009
2,751
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2000 was just an example. The point is that things being pleasant does not necessarily mean they will last or can last. Another example- if you get "high" off [insert drug of choice here], you feel great when you are high, but it does not last. Some things are not sustainable no matter what. In fact, they can be bad in the long term. A drug user saying "But I was happy when I was high" does not mean anything.
I am sorry, I am just to stupid to get this one. If you think what we have now is "sustainable" grab your pants, you are in for a surprise. This country is in the crapper, don't care what the "global data" says.:p
 

myp

Jan 2009
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50
I am sorry, I am just to stupid to get this one. If you think what we have now is "sustainable" grab your pants, you are in for a surprise. This country is in the crapper, don't care what the "global data" says.:p
I never said what we have now is sustainable, I said the 50s-60s weren't.
 
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