Republicans: I WARNED YOU.

myp · Jan 14, 2013

On the rules: any words are open to interpretation. By default (considering the staff holds infraction power), it is the power of the staff to discuss, interpret, and infract (when necessary) to enforce the rules. Part of our rules stress respect- I read what you had said earlier as snark- my interpretation, but interpretation is interpretation. Anyway, let's drop this tangent.

Stonewall said:
That's my entire point, Sir! It isn't an economic theory.....it's economic reality. It's the economic reality that built this nation, it's the economic reality of capitalism, it's even the reality of government taxing and redistributing, that is trickle down reality, not theory. Thank you for finally understanding!

I am using the scientific definition of theory, not the colloquial one.

Stonewall · Jan 14, 2013

tecoyah said:
While I agree every member here should be allowed to express opinion, create discussion, and enjoy each other...There must be controls to human interaction should we wish to create such an atmosphere. On occasion it becomes important to make it clear when this stability is compromised.

It is important to understand this is not an attack on the individual, but instead a means of maintaining a civil and enjoyable place for the membership/community.

The beauty/detriment of this type of system is seen by each member individually, and the experience quite unique. However, we must evaluate everyone in the context of what has been created here and when one seems to be less than ideal, we try to guide toward the ideal.

I personally, have noted a few things that cause concern...as I have explained through PM.

I am impressed with what you bring thus far, as well as the ability to adapt to what we desire....Please continue to do so.

I am not impressed with what I've found so far. Folk more concerned about this post or that being "less than ideal" or conforming to some unwritten "what we desire."

Can we discuss content and topic matter now? In other words, are you boys gonna pull them pistols...or are you gonna continue to whistle Dixie?

tecoyah · Jan 14, 2013

Stonewall said:
I am not impressed with what I've found so far. Folk more concerned about this post or that being "less than ideal" or conforming to some unwritten "what we desire."

Can we discuss content and topic matter now? In other words, are you boys gonna pull them pistols...or are you gonna continue to whistle Dixie?

We could have discussed it...however you do not seem worth the effort.

We are not here to impress you, nor do we require your presence.

Stonewall · Jan 14, 2013

tecoyah said:
We could have discussed it...however you do not seem worth the effort.

We are not here to impress you, nor do we require your presence.

Who is we?

For the love of God and what in the world? Moving on.

The argument in the thread start dismissed trickle down economics and warned the Republicans they must realize the "theory" isn't working anymore. Tell me then how this American economy works, is it not a trickle down economy, has it not always been so from Constitiution to present day.

Protectionist · Jan 16, 2013

Stonewall said:
Words that came into your head but 'can't be denied', right?

It is "the rich" trying to "trick" the "lower classes?" You are a walking talking point, Sir. Look at your 'this or that cannot be denied' nonsense, the "rich" aren't to be grouped into any single thought no more than I could claim whites, Jewish, or women can be grouped into a singlular thought process. Quit watching John Stewart and/or Oprah for your news, Liberal.

I'm stuck to no agenda(another talking point becase you cannot debate me fairly), I simply am telling you no other economic system exists but trickle down economics in any free representative society. It's how this nation was built, it's how nearly every free culture from ancient Greece to Revolutionary America was born. The book covered with dust with the binding still uncracked on the shelf there is called American History. I suggest you read it.:smug:

I 'lose out' on many handouts, Sir, my guess is.....you don't.

Trickle down economics is utter nonsense. It is a phony excuse that running dog politicians for the rich came up with to try to justify low taxes on the rich, who didn't want to pay the NORMAL American tax rates for their tax bracket (70%+)

Looking at the history of top bracket taxes since 1950, it's quite obvious that all trickle down economics does is keep the rich richer than they would be had they been paying the normal rates. As far as job and GDP growth are concerned, they've been best when top taxes were 75-80%. Second best when they were 90%+, and dismally bad during the Reagan-Bush trickle down years (1988-91) of 28-31%.

PS - Me a "liberal" ? LOL. You might want to take a look at some of the earlier posts in this thread before you do any more classifying. (see Posts # 6, 12, 13, 15)

Or these OPs:

http://www.politicalfray.com/showthread.php?t=3670

http://www.politicalfray.com/showthread.php?t=3567

Protectionist · Jan 16, 2013

Stonewall said:
You're mistaken. There is no other economic system....it doesn't exist. You can call it top down, trickle down, you can call it whtever you'd like. Human beings are not equals as far as production and intelligence are concerned. You may debate how to transfer or redistribute funds, it comes down to the same thing.

Otherwise, you'd give me the name of the last poor person who hired you.

Of course there's another economic system >> PERCOLATE UP ECONOMICS

Or are you too young to remember when HHH called for PERCOLATE UP ECONOMICS during the 1968 US presidential campaign ? Or too young to remember percolate up coffee makers. :giggle:

As for Human beings not being equal as far as production and intelligence are concerned, so what if they're not ? Doesn't mean one should receive hundreds of times as much money as the other. In the overall scheme of things, every man's job is important, or they wouldn't be there at all.

Protectionist · Jan 16, 2013

Stonewall said:
Oh...there was a point being made that I missed? The entire point being made here....is a talking point. The rants about the rich.....or warnings about Republicans......you can hear from any talking head on TV.

I'm giving you reality and if it's a tangent then so be it. Trickle down economics is reality, we're all living it right now. And it's resulted in the greatest economy and country known to the planet....to date. That's not a talking point....it's just the way it is. Still confused?

FALSE! Trickle down has been a dismal failure, and it has never been anything more than a SCAM (masquerading as an economic system)

As for me using talking points of the left, :giggle: I wouldn't even know what they are. I only have basic cable TV. I don't get CNN or MSNBC. I make my own talking points (sometimes they may coincide with others, sure)

Protectionist · Jan 16, 2013

Stonewall said:
Who is we?

For the love of God and what in the world? Moving on.

The argument in the thread start dismissed trickle down economics and warned the Republicans they must realize the "theory" isn't working anymore. Tell me then how this American economy works, is it not a trickle down economy, has it not always been so from Constitiution to present day.

I have a question for you, Stonewall. And I'm not trying to be snark. Really I'm not, and I'll explain why I ask this question in upcoming posts. How old are you ?

Stonewall · Jan 16, 2013

Protectionist said:
Trickle down economics is utter nonsense

What economic structure then built the economy of the United States?

Oops.

Stonewall · Jan 16, 2013

Protectionist said:
I have a question for you, Stonewall. And I'm not trying to be snark. Really I'm not, and I'll explain why I ask this question in upcoming posts. How old are you ?

Old enough to realize this "trickle down" dog of an argument you're trying to convince me of won't hunt.

Stonewall · Jan 16, 2013

Protectionist said:
FALSE! Trickle down has been a dismal failure......

As you type on your laptop or pc over a wide fiber ring of internet bandwidth. Got a smart phone....drive a car?

Oops.

myp · Jan 16, 2013

Is anyone interested in having an actual discussion and not arguing over made-up theories like "percolate up" and misrepresentations like "trickle down"?

Gottago · Jan 16, 2013

Protectionist said:
FALSE! Trickle down has been a dismal failure, and it has never been anything more than a SCAM (masquerading as an economic system)

As for me using talking points of the left, :giggle: I wouldn't even know what they are. I only have basic cable TV. I don't get CNN or MSNBC. I make my own talking points (sometimes they may coincide with others, sure)

So that last you worked for a poor person was when?

You don't. You want to make sure the employer has enough money to be able to pay you and anyone else working for them.

So someone at 'the top' has to be spending money, purchasing from one company, who purchases from another company, who purchases from the company that produces the goods.

A pyramid, so to speak. If you apply that to 'trickle up' economics, the pyramid has no balance, and just as when you climb a ladder, it takes a great deal more effort to go up, then go down.

The true failure in the current economic situation came when the government demanded that loans be made to individuals and companies with lax laws that pretty much ignored the ability to pay those loans back. And all the perifrial maneuvering in the financial sector related to those loans, and that was the recipe.

Not cutting taxes for the wealthy. But it makes for one hell of a scapegoat, doesn't it.

Stonewall · Jan 16, 2013

myp said:
Is anyone interested in having an actual discussion and not arguing over made-up theories like "percolate up" and misrepresentations like "trickle down"?

Exactly. And I'll ask you myp....what is the economic force that built this country? I should say built the United States. Did Henry Ford trickle wealth down for example?

Trickle down isn't a theory, it's a reality.

myp · Jan 16, 2013

Stonewall said:
Exactly. And I'll ask you myp....what is the economic force that built this country? I should say built the United States. Did Henry Ford trickle wealth down for example?

Trickle down isn't a theory, it's a reality.

You are still using the colloquial definition of theory...

Stonewall · Jan 16, 2013

myp said:
You are still using the colloquial definition of theory...

I'm not defining any theory, myp, you seem confused.

myp · Jan 16, 2013

Stonewall said:
I'm not defining any theory, myp, you seem confused.

You don't know what theory means as I am using it is what I am saying. Trickle down does not have enough facts behind it to call it a theory. Actually, it isn't even a hypothesis in the literature because it isn't a technical term- it is a political term to hurt other real theories. I have never seen anyone actually defend it like you are because the term is meant to be an insult. What you are doing by defending it is akin to a pro-choice person saying "I believe in the right to baby kill" which is something they'd never say because they don't think abortion is baby-killing. (let's not turn this into a debate about abortion- that was an analogy)

Stonewall · Jan 16, 2013

myp said:
You don't know what theory means as I am using it is what I am saying. Trickle down does not have enough facts behind it to call it a theory. Actually, it isn't even a hypothesis in the literature because it isn't a technical term- it is a political term to hurt other real theories. I have never seen anyone actually defend it like you are because the term is meant to be an insult. What you are doing by defending it is akin to a pro-choice person saying "I believe in the right to baby kill" which is something they'd never say because they don't think abortion is baby-killing. (let's not turn this into a debate about abortion- that was an analogy)

And a poor analogy it was. Trickle down I agree with you is a talking point, a political one at that, and has become a deragatory term for some observers, obviously you are one of these Observers. I don't defend the term.....I'm explaining to you what you call reality really doesn't matter....it doesn't change that reality.

I'll ask again and take note you appear to have difficulty answering this question. What was the economic model that turned the United States into the most propsperous and powerful nation in this planet's history.

With warm regards -Stonewall

myp · Jan 16, 2013

It wasn't "trickle down". The government didn't give billions of dollars to the richest and watch it go down. It was actually quite different and much more complex... built on the hard work of a nation from the bottom up and with some luck in having great resource availability and good stretches of political stability amongst other things.

Stonewall · Jan 16, 2013

The government never until recently had billions to give, myp! Roosevelt the first President to start trickling down funds from government(the taxpayer). This nation's industrial revolution wasn't bottom up, myp. The government wasn't ever this nation's top employer if one excluded the military. Private sector wealth and asset far outweighed public wealth, that is what unleashed our revolution.

Even our latest technological explosion was trickle down reality. I always agreed the credit for the 1990s economic growth belonged to a Bill. But I submit his last name was Gates, not Clinton. I would submit to you that Bill Gates and/or Steve Jobs have created more wealth, employed more humanity, and influenced your life and our economy more than you know.

Republicans: I WARNED YOU.

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