Are US armed forces out of control? (spin-off thread)

[chuck schmidt]

I wonder how many that would have gone to "GITMO" got a bullet in the head. I can see a soldier doing that if he knows this guy just tried to kill him and his buddies. Because he now knows some "empty suit" in Washington may let him go.

Is the US armed forces that out of control?

 

[DodgeFB]

Is the US armed forces that out of control?

No. Just the suits that think the military should act like they are a policeman back home in the US. Read them their rights and offer them an attorney at the US expense. What a way to fight a war.

 

[chuck schmidt]

No. Just the suits that think the military should act like they are a policeman back home in the US. Read them their rights and offer them an attorney at the US expense. What a way to fight a war.

Once combat is over and you are keeping the peace in a civil population that's exactly what you are. Who gave you the right to go into Baghdad and take people from their homes based on their politics? Is that what you think the army should do in CONUS?

 

[DodgeFB]

Once combat is over and you are keeping the peace in a civil population that's exactly what you are. Who gave you the right to go into Baghdad and take people from their homes based on their politics? Is that what you think the army should do in CONUS?

I was not talking about taking people from their home. I am talking about the ones who attack our troops anywhere at anytime. And they damn sure know when they are attacked. They don't need some judge here to tell them yes you were probably attacked.

 

[chuck schmidt]

I was not talking about taking people from their home.

In Baghdad that is exactly what happened. Combat operations were over and that fact had been officially announced. Remember "Mission Accomplished?" The only thing left was operations in support of civil authorities yet US forces responded with full combat arms in support of mere arrests.

I am talking about the ones who attack our troops anywhere at anytime. And they damn sure know when they are attacked.

If US troops remain in-country after combat operations are over and use combat tactics and supporting arms for civil law enforcement, they deserve getting tarred with the same brush as Nazi SS. It might be the fault of commanders and not the fault of individual men who have to carry out the duties, but that's not the world's problem.

 

[deanhills]

If US troops remain in-country after combat operations are over and use combat tactics and supporting arms for civil law enforcement, they deserve getting tarred with the same brush as Nazi SS.

Thiss is going a bit extreme, don't you think? This is the problem when the media gets to focus on that which is not working in excess of that which is working in the military. I cannot in my remotest imagination compare the US Military with Nazi SS excesses.

That does not say that the military is completely innocent and above the law either, but with the little I have seen, it would appear that there is no one stricter than the military, on the military. I think the media has a good place in bringing excesses to the attention of people, but then it has to be balanced. For me there are a majority of soldiers in the military who need to also be considered, honoured and respected and talk like Nazi SS does not do much for them.

 

[DodgeFB]

In Baghdad that is exactly what happened. Combat operations were over and that fact had been officially announced. Remember "Mission Accomplished?" The only thing left was operations in support of civil authorities yet US forces responded with full combat arms in support of mere arrests.




If US troops remain in-country after combat operations are over and use combat tactics and supporting arms for civil law enforcement, they deserve getting tarred with the same brush as Nazi SS. It might be the fault of commanders and not the fault of individual men who have to carry out the duties, but that's not the world's problem.

As far as I am concerned US troops need to do whatever they feel is necessary at the time for their protection. And the same government that sent them should back them up. Not try to jam them up. And all this giving enemy combatants the same rights as an American citizen in the US is just wrong in my opinion.

 

[GOP]

If US troops remain in-country after combat operations are over and use combat tactics and supporting arms for civil law enforcement, they deserve getting tarred with the same brush as Nazi SS. It might be the fault of commanders and not the fault of individual men who have to carry out the duties, but that's not the world's problem.

This is really very extreme. Nazi-Germany had an agenda to murder innocent people who doesn't belong to the Aryan race. Now the American soldiers agenda is not so evil and they've liberated countries, Americans have NOT created dictatorships in them.

 

[Dirk]

This is really very extreme. Nazi-Germany had an agenda to murder innocent people who doesn't belong to the Aryan race. Now the American soldiers agenda is not so evil and they've liberated countries, Americans have NOT created dictatorships in them.

Are you talking only about Iraq & Afghanistan?

If you aren't, i suggest you claim you are. :giggle:

Though there's still the reconstruction of the warlord system...

 

[GOP]

Yes, Iraq and Afghanistan. Saddam Hussein was removed from power, and now in Iraq Shiites and the Kurdish people are having a more peaceful time then they had under Saddam Hussein, just a concrete example. And also with the Taliban being removed from power back in 2001.

 

[chuck schmidt]

Thiss is going a bit extreme, don't you think? This is the problem when the media gets to focus on that which is not working in excess of that which is working in the military. I cannot in my remotest imagination compare the US Military with Nazi SS excesses.

I would readily agree that the US has not yet done what the SS did at its worst. If it comes right down to it I don't know exactly what arms of the Nazi forces were responsible, but things done by America in my lifetime are no better than Nazi Germany.

I would say that much of what media reported the US as doing in Iraq is exactly the same things I grew up hearing that the fascists did in Europe to give them their reputation. My Lai? Abu Ghraib prison? US military ops against civilians in Iraq after the cease fire? How about just the illegal Iraq war all by itself? If you are from my generation, much of this is what you read about in 20th Century history describing the Nazis.

Mind you this is off topic, for which I apologize.

 

[David]

I would readily agree that the US has not yet done what the SS did at its worst. If it comes right down to it I don't know exactly what arms of the Nazi forces were responsible, but things done by America in my lifetime are no better than Nazi Germany.

I would say that much of what media reported the US as doing in Iraq is exactly the same things I grew up hearing that the fascists did in Europe to give them their reputation. My Lai? Abu Ghraib prison? US military ops against civilians in Iraq after the cease fire? How about just the illegal Iraq war all by itself? If you are from my generation, much of this is what you read about in 20th Century history describing the Nazis.

Mind you this is off topic, for which I apologize.

Wow, you just did a Godwin and think it's a valid point?

 

[deanhills]

I would readily agree that the US has not yet done what the SS did at its worst. If it comes right down to it I don't know exactly what arms of the Nazi forces were responsible, but things done by America in my lifetime are no better than Nazi Germany.

I would say that much of what media reported the US as doing in Iraq is exactly the same things I grew up hearing that the fascists did in Europe to give them their reputation. My Lai? Abu Ghraib prison? US military ops against civilians in Iraq after the cease fire? How about just the illegal Iraq war all by itself? If you are from my generation, much of this is what you read about in 20th Century history describing the Nazis.

Mind you this is off topic, for which I apologize.

Agreed it is off topic. We probably will also have to agree that we disagree.

 

[Dirk]

Hehe. Godwin's law, anybody?

 

[Dirk]

Oh, damnation! Comrade David beat me to it.

 

[GOP]

I would readily agree that the US has not yet done what the SS did at its worst. If it comes right down to it I don't know exactly what arms of the Nazi forces were responsible, but things done by America in my lifetime are no better than Nazi Germany.

Not yet? This is a really hateful post towards the United States. Nazi-Germany's agenda was to conquer countries, eliminate all other races but the Aryan race. This is not America's agenda, their agenda is to liberate countries (that's exactly what they've done).

I would say that much of what media reported the US as doing in Iraq is exactly the same things I grew up hearing that the fascists did in Europe to give them their reputation. My Lai? Abu Ghraib prison? US military ops against civilians in Iraq after the cease fire? How about just the illegal Iraq war all by itself? If you are from my generation, much of this is what you read about in 20th Century history describing the Nazis.

And all these things are to keep extremists away from civilization so they don't harm anyone.

 

[deanhills]

Not yet? This is a really hateful post towards the United States. Nazi-Germany's agenda was to conquer countries, eliminate all other races but the Aryan race. This is not America's agenda, their agenda is to liberate countries (that's exactly what they've done).



And all these things are to keep extremists away from civilization so they don't harm anyone.

Totally agreed. One thing for sure is that capital punishment by the Nazis would be more concentrated and widely applied, including execution of people in large groups and confiscation (daylight robbery) of the people they have executed's assets. I don't see any similar behaviour by the Government or Military of the United States.

 

[GOP]

Totally agreed. One thing for sure is that capital punishment by the Nazis would be more concentrated and widely applied, including execution of people in large groups and confiscation (daylight robbery) of the people they have executed's assets. I don't see any similar behaviour by the Government or Military of the United States.

Absolutely! And also the fact the United States have tried to prevent discrimination in other countries. The Shiites and Kurdish people in Iraq, who lived under horrible conditions under Saddam Hussein. And they've also given girls an opportunity of going to school in Afghanistan, compared to how the conditions for females were back when Taliban ruled the country, they were gassed and killed if they were seen heading off to school. All these groups of people are very glad for what Bush did.

 

[DodgeFB]

Totally agreed. One thing for sure is that capital punishment by the Nazis would be more concentrated and widely applied, including execution of people in large groups and confiscation (daylight robbery) of the people they have executed's assets. I don't see any similar behaviour by the Government or Military of the United States.

It is a good thing this country does not keep people trapped here. They can always go to one of those "better" places the US is always compared to.

 

[deanhills]

It is a good thing this country does not keep people trapped here. They can always go to one of those "better" places the US is always compared to.

Right, I hear they have discovered water on the moon, may become an ideal destination one of these days?:giggle: